Penzance to benefit the more from dual signing arrangement with Helston?

[cornish leg end]

19 minutes ago, Postman Pat said:

Can you not remember when Mousehole first started their new adventure. They were slagged from puller to post on here.

The difference is you see the progress and the plans, the way they do business. Can’t knock Mousehole 

[silly billy]

46 minutes ago, Way Of The Park said:

Often thought some clubs are very much "love to hate" on here.

Not Peninsula League I know, but contrast what is said about Helston and Mousehole (especially Jake Ash and Steve Massey).

Maybe it's more to do with how the managers conduct themselves on match days, Bodmin, St Blazey, Dobwalls etc always get slated on here, then you got the likes of Wadebridge, Sticker etc who normally aren't over vocal match days so tend to keep a low profile on here.

[TheolderIgetthebetterIwas]

3 hours ago, Postman Pat said:

Can you not remember when Mousehole first started their new adventure. They were slagged from puller to post on here.

Pillar maybe...lol.

[Martin Eddy]

18 hours ago, TheolderIgetthebetterIwas said:

Pillar maybe...lol.

Bleedy fat fingers

21 hours ago, cornish leg end said:

The difference is you see the progress and the plans, the way they do business. Can’t knock Mousehole 

Not trying amazing where they are considering the geography. That ground is amazing and gets better every time you go there

[THEMAGPIE]

I’m sorry but I wish people would stop tip toeing around this situation!

Penzance have basically been unable to raise a competitive side for a number of seasons now, they’ve appointed a management team and are still have reservations about raising a competitive squad! 
what management team would be happy with this sort of arrangement with Helston 

Basically making a mockery of the League and why they just don’t drop down into Combination or St Piran’s so they can be possibly competitive is beyond me! 
Backward steps again into another cycle of bad decisions from the Club.

 

[6times]

2 hours ago, THEMAGPIE said:

I’m sorry but I wish people would stop tip toeing around this situation!

Penzance have basically been unable to raise a competitive side for a number of seasons now, they’ve appointed a management team and are still have reservations about raising a competitive squad! 
what management team would be happy with this sort of arrangement with Helston 

Basically making a mockery of the League and why they just don’t drop down into Combination or St Piran’s so they can be possibly competitive is beyond me! 
Backward steps again into another cycle of bad decisions from the Club.

 

Drop out/down what a load of crap , I for 1 think this is a good option I believe pz mangers will be able to make decisions on THEIR team , and if they USE 1 or 2 helston players here and there and helps them get results ,be competitive lifting them up the league , next summer they’ll find it easier to get players in  for long term gain . 

If/ when they have a full squad and additional 2-3 helston players available then that’s where they’ll have to manage it correctly. 
good luck to pz from me . 

[Gary S]

I think it is great partnership for all concerned. 
 

Helston squad players can get a good run out when they are lacking game time or returning from injury. Penzance can get a few extra bodies in to help with the demanding schedule of the Peninsula league. 
 

Some of the ‘fringe’ players of the Helston’s first team squad who live in Cornwall might actually decide they enjoy playing their football at Penzance and decide to stay there for longer than originally planned. 

Players already at Penzance will naturally step their game up and become better players by having to fight to stay in the first team. 
 

I do feel that it does seem to over look reserve side players at both clubs, who are all probably a touch annoyed with the decision, especially the ones with aspirations to play higher and may not get much of a look in.  
 

This partnership would not have been rushed into and I personally hope it works out for everyone involved 

[sportsman10]

1 hour ago, Gary S said:

I think it is great partnership for all concerned. 
 

Helston squad players can get a good run out when they are lacking game time or returning from injury. Penzance can get a few extra bodies in to help with the demanding schedule of the Peninsula league. 
 

Some of the ‘fringe’ players of the Helston’s first team squad who live in Cornwall might actually decide they enjoy playing their football at Penzance and decide to stay there for longer than originally planned. 

Players already at Penzance will naturally step their game up and become better players by having to fight to stay in the first team. 
 

I do feel that it does seem to over look reserve side players at both clubs, who are all probably a touch annoyed with the decision, especially the ones with aspirations to play higher and may not get much of a look in.  
 

This partnership would not have been rushed into and I personally hope it works out for everyone involved 

 helston player can get  to use penzance as a good run out  or get fit from coming back from injury lol.

 Come on this isn’t a Sunday pub team. This is meant to be a big club in Cornwall top league.  . I don’t know any other team in that  league who would even dream  of doing it.  
Are Falmouth going be  sending a few fringe  players to help out at st blazey  and get fit.  ?? 
 

[silly billy]

6 hours ago, sportsman10 said:

 helston player can get  to use penzance as a good run out  or get fit from coming back from injury lol.

 Come on this isn’t a Sunday pub team. This is meant to be a big club in Cornwall top league.  . I don’t know any other team in that  league who would even dream  of doing it.  
Are Falmouth going be  sending a few fringe  players to help out at st blazey  and get fit.  ?? 
 

It's non league football played for a bit of entertainment, it's not that serious.

[Footy follower]

8 hours ago, sportsman10 said:

 helston player can get  to use penzance as a good run out  or get fit from coming back from injury lol.

 Come on this isn’t a Sunday pub team. This is meant to be a big club in Cornwall top league.  . I don’t know any other team in that  league who would even dream  of doing it.  
Are Falmouth going be  sending a few fringe  players to help out at st blazey  and get fit.  ?? 
 

Isn't your club Plymouth Parkway? I remember seeing that you have a few Argyle players playing for you last season 🙄

[silly billy]

37 minutes ago, Footy follower said:

Isn't your club Plymouth Parkway? I remember seeing that you have a few Argyle players playing for you last season 🙄

That's a good point, they gave a couple of youngsters a good run out, which played a big part in some of Parkway's wins.

[Tom Jacobson]

15 hours ago, THEMAGPIE said:

I’m sorry but I wish people would stop tip toeing around this situation!

Penzance have basically been unable to raise a competitive side for a number of seasons now, they’ve appointed a management team and are still have reservations about raising a competitive squad! 
what management team would be happy with this sort of arrangement with Helston 

Basically making a mockery of the League and why they just don’t drop down into Combination or St Piran’s so they can be possibly competitive is beyond me! 
Backward steps again into another cycle of bad decisions from the Club.

 

Being a Penzance 'supporter', first of all, you should know the struggles we've faced over the last few seasons with no budget, chairmans coming in and out etc. Reno and Kev gave their all over the last few seasons and also did the players. 

 

There is full faith in Adrian and Jonny Mac and we are looking in the right direction. The partnership with Helston will be nothing but good for both clubs, players on the fringe of Helston 1s getting good experience in SWPL and our players looking at taking a step up. 

 

As for the comment on us taking relegation, don't be silly. It's been a tough few seasons but we are on the right tracks.

[le boss]

11 hours ago, Gary S said:

I think it is great partnership for all concerned. 
 

Helston squad players can get a good run out when they are lacking game time or returning from injury. Penzance can get a few extra bodies in to help with the demanding schedule of the Peninsula league. 
 

Some of the ‘fringe’ players of the Helston’s first team squad who live in Cornwall might actually decide they enjoy playing their football at Penzance and decide to stay there for longer than originally planned. 

Players already at Penzance will naturally step their game up and become better players by having to fight to stay in the first team. 
 

I do feel that it does seem to over look reserve side players at both clubs, who are all probably a touch annoyed with the decision, especially the ones with aspirations to play higher and may not get much of a look in.  
 

This partnership would not have been rushed into and I personally hope it works out for everyone involved 

If they’re on the fringe it’s probably for a reason. Having seen the reserves at Helston last year, there wasn’t one who was good enough to step into the first team. Aspiration is great but you have to back it up with ability. 

9 hours ago, sportsman10 said:

 helston player can get  to use penzance as a good run out  or get fit from coming back from injury lol.

 Come on this isn’t a Sunday pub team. This is meant to be a big club in Cornwall top league.  . I don’t know any other team in that  league who would even dream  of doing it.  
Are Falmouth going be  sending a few fringe  players to help out at st blazey  and get fit.  ?? 
 

Be interesting if it starts to come to fruition whether other clubs do try it. No doubt all the knockers  on here will change their tune completely. Clubs have got to start thinking outside the box because as is continually stated on this forum, chucking money at football isn’t seen as the way forward. Let’s pass judgement at the end of the season. If it works, it might just save a few clubs from having to pull out of leagues- and that is not a dig at anyone who has sadly had to do that. 

[Ian Pethick]

37 minutes ago, le boss said:

If they’re on the fringe it’s probably for a reason. Having seen the reserves at Helston last year, there wasn’t one who was good enough to step into the first team. Aspiration is great but you have to back it up with ability. 

Be interesting if it starts to come to fruition whether other clubs do try it. No doubt all the knockers  on here will change their tune completely. Clubs have got to start thinking outside the box because as is continually stated on this forum, chucking money at football isn’t seen as the way forward. Let’s pass judgement at the end of the season. If it works, it might just save a few clubs from having to pull out of leagues- and that is not a dig at anyone who has sadly had to do that. 

You're right in saying that clubs have to start thinking outside of the box. I'll be watching the tie up/merger between Liskeard and St Cleer with interest, could be a blueprint in terms of clubs sharing resources and facilities. Know that the two most recent Cornish clubs to be forced into withdrawal from the Peninsula League was about a lack of players, but the shortage of administrators and volunteers is also a continual source of concern.  So if clubs can share functions such as secretary and treasury, that can work for both of them. 

Looking into Devon, Tavistock have announced the creation of a development side this season. Interestingly, they won't run a formal reserve side within a league, but will have players that they want to monitor signed on with them, training with the Southern League side and appearing in pre season matches, but they will be loaned out to other clubs each week. Don't know who these players will feature for, but it does seem like a formal nursery club deal. Similar sort of arrangement to that between Helston and Penzance I would think, but on a more permanent footing than just those first team players that won't be required on a Saturday. 

 

[sportsman10]

Your correct parkway have used young players from argyle on loan basis and most there for 3-6 months so you can plan with them in the team accordingly  not just 1-2 games and players just pushed onto you without asking. .   They have also used players from youth team

why  can’t helston use the 2nd team ? 

if as suggested this could be the new normal  ,the bigger higher leagues clubs using other lower Cornish teams as reserve  that can’t be good for the standard of the Cornish game. 
 

[THEMAGPIE]

7 hours ago, Tom Jacobson said:

Being a Penzance 'supporter', first of all, you should know the struggles we've faced over the last few seasons with no budget, chairmans coming in and out etc. Reno and Kev gave their all over the last few seasons and also did the players. 

 

There is full faith in Adrian and Jonny Mac and we are looking in the right direction. The partnership with Helston will be nothing but good for both clubs, players on the fringe of Helston 1s getting good experience in SWPL and our players looking at taking a step up. 

 

As for the comment on us taking relegation, don't be silly. It's been a tough few seasons but we are on the right tracks.

I’m well aware of the struggles Penzance have faced for the past 10 years or so, and when you say “don’t be silly” I would like to just put this to you, how can a Club with a thriving youth section with teams a plenty, an Under 18s and a Reserve team with a youthful core with once a very good manager as well be struggling and needing to borrow players from Helston? 
To me that says something is seriously wrong in the whole setup or maybe that’s another “silly comment”

you tell me.

[RAPPO]

Think it’s a good initiative and quite forward thinking in my opinion. Two fine old Cornish clubs doing each other a favour! From Mass and Cusi’s point of view, good for a long or short term injured player to get back up to speed in the SWPL rather than with their reserves in the SPL as good a league as it is, it’s quite a gap to Western league football. Even a talented SPL player without a fixture could step up a league and be used for the Magpies and prove he’s good enough to play at that level which would help him enormously confidence wise as an individual. From a Penzance point of view I’m sure they would relish having a say Matty Bye around their squad and young players in the dressing room for a game or two, they would learn a lot I’m sure. I’m sure Johnnymac and Adrian will select their team for each individual game as they see it and I doubt would be bullied into playing anyone! It’s just a nice bonus to have a higher standard player at their disposal to use how they see fit. You see this all over the world these days with feeder clubs, I don’t see any reason it wouldn’t work in Cornish football. There’s quite a few clubs with close friendships over the years that could copy it? Is it any different really to a player signing as cover which has gone on for years! I guess it’s all about opinions at the end of the day but I see more positives with it than negatives if I’m honest. Time will tell I’m sure! 👏🏼👍⚽️

[Buckland Jim]

To me it's no different to utilising the loans system to the max, if it works, good luck to Penzance. 

[Yourhavingalaugh]

Personally, I don’t think either club will benefit in the long term, and it could get a bit messy. Example, Helston playing away and Penzance playing at home on the same day. The Helston bench is a bit short for their away trip to Wellington, so asks a Penzance player (probably one of their better players) to travel to Wellington to sit on the bench 🤔 Obviously there will be benefits, but I think the shortfall’s with overshadow the benefits. 

[100%cornish]

I think this is wrong say Penzance has a midweek match and Helston hasnt would Penzance then load there team up with some of the good players Helston have and give some poor little team a hammering 

[THEMAGPIE]

What’s the point in the Club having a youth system and reserves then, may as well say to all involved from the outset that they’re not going to get a look in 🤷‍♂️

[John Mead]

2 hours ago, THEMAGPIE said:

What’s the point in the Club having a youth system and reserves then, may as well say to all involved from the outset that they’re not going to get a look in 🤷‍♂️

For many, it's too big a step to go straight from Youth or Trelawny to Peninsula football and to a lesser degree, from St Piran to Western League. The arrangement will provide a more gradual pathway for the ambitious and talented youngsters from both clubs. It's all about player development - rather than Pz playing "ringers" each week or not using their "home bred" players.

[Dave Deacon]

I think its a case of judging after its been going for a while 👍

[John Mead]

12 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

I think its a case of judging after its been going for a while 👍

Exactly, Dave. Too many premature judgements!

[CRD]

13 hours ago, John Mead said:

For many, it's too big a step to go straight from Youth or Trelawny to Peninsula football and to a lesser degree, from St Piran to Western League. The arrangement will provide a more gradual pathway for the ambitious and talented youngsters from both clubs. It's all about player development - rather than Pz playing "ringers" each week or not using their "home bred" players.

I actually think that this is a great idea that potentially supports the needs of players and both clubs. However, will it be possible to dual register across SWPL and Western League after impending restructure next season?

[Yourhavingalaugh]

This sort of arrangement must have been discussed elsewhere in the County in the past, however, I’m unaware of any such arrangement being made, and whether any have been a continued success. From the outside (without knowing any of the facts/details) it looks like slapping on a sticking plaster on Penzance 1st team for the forthcoming season. However, if it works out, what a great decision and Penzance should be able to stand on their own two feet next season. Best of luck to Penzance and Helston for the forthcoming season.

[le boss]

I really don’t think it’s any different to all the dual registration that takes place each season. Only time will tell if it’s an idea that others will implement. A lot of people on here have spat their dummy out without having all the facts on how it will work between the two clubs. 

[Both Sides of the Tamar]

On 01/07/2022 at 10:55, Way Of The Park said:

You're right in saying that clubs have to start thinking outside of the box. I'll be watching the tie up/merger between Liskeard and St Cleer with interest, could be a blueprint in terms of clubs sharing resources and facilities. Know that the two most recent Cornish clubs to be forced into withdrawal from the Peninsula League was about a lack of players, but the shortage of administrators and volunteers is also a continual source of concern.  So if clubs can share functions such as secretary and treasury, that can work for both of them. 

Looking into Devon, Tavistock have announced the creation of a development side this season. Interestingly, they won't run a formal reserve side within a league, but will have players that they want to monitor signed on with them, training with the Southern League side and appearing in pre season matches, but they will be loaned out to other clubs each week. Don't know who these players will feature for, but it does seem like a formal nursery club deal. Similar sort of arrangement to that between Helston and Penzance I would think, but on a more permanent footing than just those first team players that won't be required on a Saturday. 

 

Bodmin Town also have joined forces with AFC Bodmin who will become BTFC Reserves. New faces / teams help provide fresh impetus to a club  Long term a 'win' for football in the town.

[glass hips]

Penzance were struggling I’m sure every opportunity needed to be explored, well done to the management or committee,or if helston approached penzance .. lucky them !!!! I’m sure or I’d like to think penryn would have jumped at the chance , look what’s happened to them . 
I see nothing wrong with player loans if it helps both clubs . 

[Ian Pethick]

6 hours ago, le boss said:

I really don’t think it’s any different to all the dual registration that takes place each season. Only time will tell if it’s an idea that others will implement. A lot of people on here have spat their dummy out without having all the facts on how it will work between the two clubs. 

You're right, possibly a formalised version of the much derided dual registration system. I would hope that it works along the lines of the loan system between Premier and Football League clubs. Players primarily assigned to the parent club, but at the partner club for a pre announced and agreed duration (with provisions in place for recalling them if necessary). The supporters then get a degree of certainty and continuity, and not just the feeling of players being parachuted in occasionally with no bond developing between them and the club.

[Tom Jacobson]

On 01/07/2022 at 17:00, THEMAGPIE said:

I’m well aware of the struggles Penzance have faced for the past 10 years or so, and when you say “don’t be silly” I would like to just put this to you, how can a Club with a thriving youth section with teams a plenty, an Under 18s and a Reserve team with a youthful core with once a very good manager as well be struggling and needing to borrow players from Helston? 
To me that says something is seriously wrong in the whole setup or maybe that’s another “silly comment”

you tell me.

Who said we were struggling for players this year?

[THEMAGPIE]

On 04/07/2022 at 08:43, Tom Jacobson said:

Who said we were struggling for players this year?

The Club! as your borrowing off Helston?

[Dave Deacon]

57 minutes ago, THEMAGPIE said:

The Club! as your borrowing off Helston?

No one is until at least the first game of the season! 

[Tom Jacobson]

On 06/07/2022 at 22:33, THEMAGPIE said:

The Club! as your borrowing off Helston?

Hang on, let me just find where Penzance have come out and said we're struggling. 

[TheRef]

If any off you have had played football manager you would agree and understand that this in all intents and purposes an affiliate feeder club situation I can see and  understand why people can have a repulsive attitude towards it. That said there's a great argument for the fact that due to our investment in local football. All party's benefit, The fact were even talking about local footballers moving to different clubs to get game time is great to see and on the whole Cornish clubs working together like this is only beneficial. Imo ofcorde 

 

[BOBBY]

On 30/06/2022 at 17:58, THEMAGPIE said:

I’m sorry but I wish people would stop tip toeing around this situation!

Penzance have basically been unable to raise a competitive side for a number of seasons now, they’ve appointed a management team and are still have reservations about raising a competitive squad! 
what management team would be happy with this sort of arrangement with Helston 

Basically making a mockery of the League and why they just don’t drop down into Combination or St Piran’s so they can be possibly competitive is beyond me! 
Backward steps again into another cycle of bad decisions from the Club.

 

Obv not a great supporter of Progress. 

On 28/06/2022 at 00:50, TheolderIgetthebetterIwas said:

Pillar maybe...lol.

And wanted PZ as there home ground. 

On 01/07/2022 at 19:05, THEMAGPIE said:

What’s the point in the Club having a youth system and reserves then, may as well say to all involved from the outset that they’re not going to get a look in 🤷‍♂️

Youth system is still in place but at the end of the day players have to be good enough to get a chance. End of. You are so negative why don't you show your face in the clubhouse and introduce yourself,, I'm sure  we can have a chat.

[St Darren]

On 02/07/2022 at 14:50, Way Of The Park said:

You're right, possibly a formalised version of the much derided dual registration system. I would hope that it works along the lines of the loan system between Premier and Football League clubs. Players primarily assigned to the parent club, but at the partner club for a pre announced and agreed duration (with provisions in place for recalling them if necessary). The supporters then get a degree of certainty and continuity, and not just the feeling of players being parachuted in occasionally with no bond developing between them and the club.

It's not quite the same as the loan system.  Those players don't play for Chelsea one week then Barnsley the next and back again when it suits.  They're generally there for a sustained period of time. 

The arrangement that Helston and Penzance have is different players being available different weeks. No continuity in it. 

One would think. Helston are holding the cards in the arrangement as its up to them when and who they let play for Penzance. 

Could work, who knows. 

[THEMAGPIE]

On 22/07/2022 at 17:21, BOBBY said:

Obv not a great supporter of Progress. 

And wanted PZ as there home ground. 

Youth system is still in place but at the end of the day players have to be good enough to get a chance. End of. You are so negative why don't you show your face in the clubhouse and introduce yourself,, I'm sure  we can have a chat.

Really? What an embarrassing post, i watched the performance on Friday against a Combination outfit who basically matched you in every department and it wasn’t pretty from a Penzance perspective, without the Helston players they’ll struggle to get out the bottom 5, basically a Combination outfit now holding on to past years, going to be a long season for Penzance that’s for certain.

13 hours ago, Box 2 Box said:

Watched Pendeen v Penzance no Helston Players last night (that I recognised) and Penzance struggled to beat a (good) combo team!

Penzance don’t  look like an SWPL outfit 🤷 I could see them struggling in St Pirans …

Wrong managerial appointments and definitely poor recruitment .. not a great use of Masseys weekly budget 🤔

 

 

You’ve just got to look at the friendlies they’re choosing to play, that’s where they are at the moment.

[le boss]

41 minutes ago, THEMAGPIE said:

Really? What an embarrassing post, i watched the performance on Friday against a Combination outfit who basically matched you in every department and it wasn’t pretty from a Penzance perspective, without the Helston players they’ll struggle to get out the bottom 5, basically a Combination outfit now holding on to past years, going to be a long season for Penzance that’s for certain.

You’ve just got to look at the friendlies they’re choosing to play, that’s where they are at the moment.

So what do you suggest? Did you apply to be manager or coach? I bet Penzance are delighted to have supporters as negative as you. We all look forward to reading your extensive plan to rectify the woes of the team and probably the club. As Thumper said “if you can’t say nothing good, don’t say nothing at all” 

[THEMAGPIE]

13 hours ago, le boss said:

So what do you suggest? Did you apply to be manager or coach? I bet Penzance are delighted to have supporters as negative as you. We all look forward to reading your extensive plan to rectify the woes of the team and probably the club. As Thumper said “if you can’t say nothing good, don’t say nothing at all” 

I suggest firstly you calm yourself down, I didn’t apply for your information as I purely don’t have the time or the energy to do a complete rebuilding job at the Club, in respects to a plan firstly I would source a youthful management setup who would be closer linked to the local youth players, possibly target someone with a Coaching background and with good local knowledge and links, I would bring the youth section closer to the Club via committee members becoming involved on a dual basis and working together to channel the youth through the senior teams. I would also prioritise the Under 18s at the Club and certainly try and give youngsters more opportunities, people say they’re not good enough after giving them minimal game time or after having 20minutes as a sub and maybe making a mistake! 
These young players need time and progressive coaching to develop, Clubs are always looking for the finished article in my opinion. Until they start utilising the promising youngsters on they’re doorstep it’ll be the same merry go round season after season, the model is all wrong, just my opinion.

[le boss]

3 hours ago, THEMAGPIE said:

I suggest firstly you calm yourself down, I didn’t apply for your information as I purely don’t have the time or the energy to do a complete rebuilding job at the Club, in respects to a plan firstly I would source a youthful management setup who would be closer linked to the local youth players, possibly target someone with a Coaching background and with good local knowledge and links, I would bring the youth section closer to the Club via committee members becoming involved on a dual basis and working together to channel the youth through the senior teams. I would also prioritise the Under 18s at the Club and certainly try and give youngsters more opportunities, people say they’re not good enough after giving them minimal game time or after having 20minutes as a sub and maybe making a mistake! 
These young players need time and progressive coaching to develop, Clubs are always looking for the finished article in my opinion. Until they start utilising the promising youngsters on they’re doorstep it’ll be the same merry go round season after season, the model is all wrong, just my opinion.

Don’t worry about me - I’m calm as a calm thing. Now isn’t it much nicer to write something that is constructive and positive? Perhaps the powers that be at Penzance will read your blueprint and some of it be implemented. 

[John Mead]

10 minutes ago, le boss said:

 Perhaps the powers that be at Penzance will read your blueprint and some of it be implemented. 

He obviously has no idea what the current blueprint is!

Always pleased to hear helpful suggestions on how to move the club forward but must point out that there is a plan already in place which covers all of the suggested strategies - and a good few more.

"Rome wasn't built in a day!"

[le boss]

26 minutes ago, John Mead said:

He obviously has no idea what the current blueprint is!

Always pleased to hear helpful suggestions on how to move the club forward but must point out that there is a plan already in place which covers all of the suggested strategies - and a good few more.

"Rome wasn't built in a day!"

Happy days. Best of luck for the season and the future. 

[THEMAGPIE]

13 hours ago, John Mead said:

He obviously has no idea what the current blueprint is!

Always pleased to hear helpful suggestions on how to move the club forward but must point out that there is a plan already in place which covers all of the suggested strategies - and a good few more.

"Rome wasn't built in a day!"

That’s good to hear John.