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Shane Krac departs Saltash Utd


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Regardless of how the situation has been handled, which looks poor from the outside. I’m I right to conclude that Saltash United are not financially in a position to take promotion and be competitive without risking the long term future of the club, and as a result, the committee have set out their ‘financial’ position and Shane Krac doesn’t agree or has been led up the garden path, and has been pushed/squeezed out, or has left for his own reasons. Is it the case that the club are trying to portray themselves as being ambitious to attract players etc , but underneath that, they are not ?. Best to be safe than sorry though, but they seem to have a loyal squad of players so the wheels shouldn’t drop off at all. 

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58 minutes ago, Box 2 Box said:

Suggestions on Twitter Saltash don’t want to or are not in a position to take promotion ?

should they decline promotion will this result in relegation ? 
 

or could they fashion a non promotion placed end to their campaign ? 

I guess the most immediate question is , what happens now to the money and sponsorship that Shane Krac brought to the club? Will that now cease, and does it blow a hole in The Ashes' finances? 

Good luck to Danny Lewis and whoever steps in to assist him (believe Adam Carter has been sounded out regarding this) in the immediate stabilising of the ship for the match against Bridgwater on Saturday.

 

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12 minutes ago, Way Of The Park said:

I guess the most immediate question is , what happens now to the money and sponsorship that Shane Krac brought to the club? Will that now cease, and does it blow a hole in The Ashes' finances? 

Good luck to Danny Lewis and whoever steps in to assist him (believe Adam Carter has been sounded out regarding this) in the immediate stabilising of the ship for the match against Bridgwater on Saturday.

 

How do you know he brought any money and sponsorship to the club?

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2 hours ago, Box 2 Box said:

Suggestions on Twitter Saltash don’t want to or are not in a position to take promotion ?

should they decline promotion will this result in relegation ? 
 

or could they fashion a non promotion placed end to their campaign ? 

Should they be in the promotion spot and refuse, they should be relegated to the St. Pirans League. 

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Saltash need to take a look at themselves what are they actually hoping to achieve ?  From what I hear Shane was very keen in leading the club to the southern league and had players very keen to come next season with that in mind so I can only assume he been told the budget isn’t there 

why get ambitious young managers in to build a squad good enough to get out of that league then think hang on this is all happening to quick we can’t afford it.  
 

I certainly wouldn’t have thought Mike landricombe, Harrison Davies , Carter etc will hang around long. 

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I find it incredible that any club with any sort of ambition whether that is to consolidate or challenge would enter into a season without knowing what the additional costs are to finish mid table or maintain and sustain a promotion push and accept promotion to the Southern league. If successful the associated costs are huge and many clubs are doing well to survive currently due to all demands.

Pre planning and constant reviewing for player budget, backroom management costs, ground maintenance and grading improvements, travel, commercial/sponsorship (player and club) and just paying the normal daily utility bills, everything has gone up in price and they are all priorities for a clubs sustainability and progression.

saltash are an ambitious club who have hardworking loyal people behind the scenes, they brought in a high profile manager to obviously improve on last years finish, not many managers have that draw of bringing in thousands of pounds in sponsor money and attracting a better standard of player but Mr Krac has all those attributes so the club must have known that and entered into this agreement with open eyes, none of it can be left to chance so it's a shame this has now happened.

im sure Danny and the others will maintain things and they will still be in and around the top four or challenging if they wish to do so, I'm sure the committee will have learnt another valuable lesson but a word of caution, be careful what you wish for in local football as unless the club is a thriving community asset with a strong and constant income stream it will also need substantial private investment and sponsorship and or a wealthy benefactor/supporter as the additional costs involved with climbing the ladder and sustaining it could break any club and that would be a sad day for local football.

 

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7 hours ago, Box 2 Box said:

Suggestions on Twitter Saltash don’t want to or are not in a position to take promotion ?

should they decline promotion will this result in relegation ? 
 

or could they fashion a non promotion placed end to their campaign ? 

If Saltash finish in a promotion place at the end of the season, yet choose not to take that position in the Southern League, they should then be made to take voluntary relegation back down to the South West Peninsula League. We should be trying to eradicate teams winning leagues etc, then not choosing to take promotion. Just what would be the point in playing otherwise? Just my opinion of course!

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Crowds of 80-90 isn’t going to sustain all the travel costs for Southern league, Now playing at western league level the crowds have gone down from SWPL Level I believe ? 
Locals just don’t seem to be interested anymore and half the crowd are family/friends of the players.

some new blood in the back room staff needed to generate some support is greatly needed

Go back 2 years the club was buzzing 

Good luck to Danny and the boys though. Go and win it if you can

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9 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

The danger is though that by insisting champions take promotion, could we be sending them on a course of self-destruction?

At risk of telling you something you already know Dave (in which case, apologies) the FA brought the Rule in to prevent “promotion-blocking” - apparently there were several leagues, particularly in the north east, where the same teams finished in the top three year after year but never took promotion which meant teams in the leagues above were “denied” their relegations and they themselves then got into financial difficulties. I think most sports fans outside the US think that a system of promotion & relegation is overall a good thing, but it only works if promotion is as automatic / mandatory as is relegation. 

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I know why Gary, call me a dinosaur but actually did that many people complain about the days of the South Western League when from time to time one team won it for a few successive seasons because they didn’t take promotion?

Football was played with a smile and when it was your turn to play a top side, you just got on with it.

Occasionally a team would go up and try their luck in the Western League, but apart from Truro they all came back. Why was that? Normally because the intrigue of playing sides from outside your patch had worn out, the attendances dwindled and the prospect of silverware diminished.

Clubs today are put in a perilous no-win position! Do they take promotion and have to work their socks off every single day to survive, or sit tight at a lower level and actually manage to enjoy their footballing time?

The higher you go, the more you have to run the club as a business - I feel a lot of our clubs don’t have that mind-thought yet and end up falling out of love with the beautiful game.

12 minutes ago, Foul Throw 3 said:

Just listened to the interview on the podcast. Didn't give much detail away but I don't expect many listeners would've expected him to. What he did elude to isn't ideal though. Losing 4 managers for their 2 senior sides in that timeframe is never going to be a good look! 

I personally think it was a very controlled interview from Shane.

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Extremely controlled from Shane. One thing we've learnt about him over the years is how passionate he is. I've no doubt how frustrated he is and he would've put everything into it, including much needed sponsorship. I did appreciate his honesty about how much goes into running a side which is sometimes missed. Not sure managers, at this level, should be paying for training though.

As Callum has alluded to above, 4 managers across the Senior sides with Robin stepping down from their Reserves recently and Steve Manuel leaving last year. Possibly unrelated events, the committee must be wondering what's next?

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59 minutes ago, Dave Deacon said:

I know why Gary, call me a dinosaur but actually did that many people complain about the days of the South Western League when from time to time one team won it for a few successive seasons because they didn’t take promotion?

Football was played with a smile and when it was your turn to play a top side, you just got on with it.

Occasionally a team would go up and try their luck in the Western League, but apart from Truro they all came back. Why was that? Normally because the intrigue of playing sides from outside your patch had worn out, the attendances dwindled and the prospect of silverware diminished.

Clubs today are put in a perilous no-win position! Do they take promotion and have to work their socks off every single day to survive, or sit tight at a lower level and actually manage to enjoy their footballing time?

The higher you go, the more you have to run the club as a business - I feel a lot of our clubs don’t have that mind-thought yet and end up falling out of love with the beautiful game.

I personally think it was a very controlled interview from Shane.

Good points Dave. Setting aside the increased demands on the football club as a business, both financial and organisational, the way the club is supported changes. As the number of people needed to run a club increases, different faces come in and take up new roles and there is a necessity for things to become more professionally run, a few of the older fans and faces become marginalised and feel they don't enjoy the same level of access to (and engagement with) club officers. 

I speak to some of the longer standing Parkway fans and, while they acknowledge the much higher quality of the football on display at step 3 level, they do miss the old Peninsula League days. Especially some of the local trips and rivalries.

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Happy to recognise the validity of both Dave’s and WOTP’s views on automatic (or not) promotion and relegation - though I suspect there were actually plenty of moaners in the old days too 😉

Personally I prefer the pyramid system with automatic promotion & relegation. I love the romance of an AFC Wimbledon or a Forest Green Rovers story, and also the reality of a trapdoor for teams that are past their sell by dates in terms of their ability to maintain a particular level. But I accept we’re into preferences and opinions here rather than a single right or wrong answer. 

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Would Saltash's current ground have passed the ground grading for Southern League anyway?

If not, how much would have needed to be spent to get it up to standard? 

Obviously the club felt it would have cost too much to raise the funds needed in the next 6-12 months in order to achieve this without putting club into financial difficulty.

However, maybe a forward thinking, ambitious committee and chair would have been planning for this eventuality one-two years prior, rather than just suddenly panicking and having a heated exchange (with yet another) manager/management team  

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7 minutes ago, Dave Deacon said:

That’s just it though Gary, it’s not automatic. The ground grading requirements are way over the top, a complete farce and unnecessary and in a lot of cases making the clubs spend money they don’t have in the first place

Fair point. I would support a longer grace period (say, after three consecutive seasons at the higher level) before upgrades are required. 

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53 minutes ago, GaryHocking said:

Happy to recognise the validity of both Dave’s and WOTP’s views on automatic (or not) promotion and relegation - though I suspect there were actually plenty of moaners in the old days too 😉

Personally I prefer the pyramid system with automatic promotion & relegation. I love the romance of an AFC Wimbledon or a Forest Green Rovers story, and also the reality of a trapdoor for teams that are past their sell by dates in terms of their ability to maintain a particular level. But I accept we’re into preferences and opinions here rather than a single right or wrong answer. 

Don't get me wrong Gary, I am totally behind the idea of automatic promotion and relegation. The years of the likes of Blazey and Bodmin winning the title, and not going up was (in my opinion) damaging for the credibility of the league and football in Cornwall. Don't think it was necessarily that good for both of the named clubs either. Blazey suffered seasons of stagnation, and Bodmin have been in decline for years. 

Just saying that there is a risk that the reason behind why people run and support the football club can get lost, and that while new supporters are very welcome, the long standing one's must be kept on side. You are quite correct that there have always been the moaners though, remember that in the midst of the thrilling climax to the 2013/14 Peninsula League season , and winner take all final match between Parkway and Saltash with over 600 in attendance on a warm May evening at Bolitho, one of the regulars complained that they couldn't get their regular standing space and it was impossible to park at the ground. I know this as a fact, because I was the one moaning...

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9 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

I know why Gary, call me a dinosaur but actually did that many people complain about the days of the South Western League when from time to time one team won it for a few successive seasons because they didn’t take promotion?

Football was played with a smile and when it was your turn to play a top side, you just got on with it.

Occasionally a team would go up and try their luck in the Western League, but apart from Truro they all came back. Why was that? Normally because the intrigue of playing sides from outside your patch had worn out, the attendances dwindled and the prospect of silverware diminished.

Clubs today are put in a perilous no-win position! Do they take promotion and have to work their socks off every single day to survive, or sit tight at a lower level and actually manage to enjoy their footballing time?

The higher you go, the more you have to run the club as a business - I feel a lot of our clubs don’t have that mind-thought yet and end up falling out of love with the beautiful game.

I personally think it was a very controlled interview from Shane.

Nail on head here Dave.  Football at the levels you talk about should be all about the community, forcing teams to take promotion is just killing the local game. 

Unfortunately we are on a peninsular and it just isn't financially feasible to maintain. 

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Wonder what the ambition of the players are in all if this all very well clubs saying they don’t want promotion but I can bet all if that Saltash team want southern league football.  Back when blazey and Bodmin were winning titles and never getting promoted players didn’t have much option to progress so we’re happy to sit pick up a few quid.
Now there are clubs like parkway , Truro , Tavistock  , Buckland  etc all playing higher level and ambitious that will happily take players away. 
 

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On 15/12/2022 at 22:09, Dave Deacon said:

The danger is though that by insisting champions take promotion, could we be sending them on a course of self-destruction?

There is an argument for that. However, I also believe that clubs should have plans in place, should this happen. Saltash must've known there was a chance this could happen. So my argument is, where's the preparation? I appreciate it must be difficult for clubs in the current climate. There's no denying that. However, there's also got to be some forward thinking/planning involved!

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32 minutes ago, Jengles Judgements said:

There is an argument for that. However, I also believe that clubs should have plans in place, should this happen. Saltash must've known there was a chance this could happen. So my argument is, where's the preparation? I appreciate it must be difficult for clubs in the current climate. There's no denying that. However, there's also got to be some forward thinking/planning involved!

Problem is the people running saltash don’t know anything about football 

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16 hours ago, Jengles Judgements said:

A real shame to see. As ultimately, that ruins football clubs!

It’s never healthy to have a husband and wife as chair and treasurer at the best of times in my opinion.

Throw into the mix an attention seeking secretary, who between the 3 of them have not an inch of football knowledge and you get what you’re seeing now.  

With no big friendlies last summer the income was replaced with money Krac bought in via sponsorships 

The current committee do nothing in terms of raising funds!

This season is Saltash’s big moment in the spotlight as thanks to Shane’s sponsorship streams they have never had a bigger budget, but with him now gone, after this season I can see them having a period of mediocrity 

Finally I learnt recently that saltash players only get paid twice a season as well.  Once at Xmas and again at the end of the season.  What sort of arrangement is that? 

 

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50 minutes ago, Hetty said:

Finally I learnt recently that saltash players only get paid twice a season as well.  Once at Xmas and again at the end of the season.  What sort of arrangement is that? 

 

I actually don’t think this is a bad principle. It encourages loyalty and probably makes a player think twice before jumping ship.

I suspect that not many/if any player declare there income from football so they’re hardly going to take Saltash to a small claims court if they’re not paid are they! 

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On 17/12/2022 at 18:41, Hetty said:

It’s never healthy to have a husband and wife as chair and treasurer at the best of times in my opinion.

Throw into the mix an attention seeking secretary, who between the 3 of them have not an inch of football knowledge and you get what you’re seeing now.  

With no big friendlies last summer the income was replaced with money Krac bought in via sponsorships 

The current committee do nothing in terms of raising funds!

This season is Saltash’s big moment in the spotlight as thanks to Shane’s sponsorship streams they have never had a bigger budget, but with him now gone, after this season I can see them having a period of mediocrity 

Finally I learnt recently that saltash players only get paid twice a season as well.  Once at Xmas and again at the end of the season.  What sort of arrangement is that? 

 

I didn't realise it was a husband and wife holding both the Chair and Treasurer roles. I suppose in some cases that could work well, others not so. Clearly it's the latter here. It's a real shame to see Saltash in a bit of a mess off the field. They've worked so hard to get where they are on it, and that's now being overshadowed by power hungry people in the boardroom. I certainly don't like the players being paid in the middle of the season, and again at the end. Doesn't sit well with me. I wonder if the players are on board with that? 🤷‍♂️

23 hours ago, FootballChat said:

I actually don’t think this is a bad principle. It encourages loyalty and probably makes a player think twice before jumping ship.

I suspect that not many/if any player declare there income from football so they’re hardly going to take Saltash to a small claims court if they’re not paid are they! 

Wouldn't they have to declare it if it came via the club's bank account? That's unless they're paid in cash, or via a third party.

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On 17/12/2022 at 19:33, FootballChat said:

I actually don’t think this is a bad principle. It encourages loyalty and probably makes a player think twice before jumping ship.

I suspect that not many/if any player declare there income from football so they’re hardly going to take Saltash to a small claims court if they’re not paid are they! 

Very good point. Perhaps more clubs would benefit from adopting such an approach.

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23 hours ago, Jengles Judgements said:

Wouldn't they have to declare it if it came via the club's bank account? That's unless they're paid in cash, or via a third party.

They still have to declare it if it’s paid cash. It doesn’t mean they do though! Whether it’s paid BACS or Cash I doubt there’s many that are declaring any of it. Hence why Helston’s recent BBC article mentioned that the players only receive “expenses”.

Not sure it’s costs them over £200 each to travel from Devon to Helston though! 

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On 19/12/2022 at 18:24, FootballChat said:

They still have to declare it if it’s paid cash. It doesn’t mean they do though! Whether it’s paid BACS or Cash I doubt there’s many that are declaring any of it. Hence why Helston’s recent BBC article mentioned that the players only receive “expenses”.

Not sure it’s costs them over £200 each to travel from Devon to Helston though! 

If it's paid in cash, you won't find many, if any, that will declare it. I can't say I blame them either. If it's via BACS, surely you'd have to declare it, as it would show in your bank account as coming from the club. That's unless it came via another source!

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