Pitty Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 It's been well documented across the forum that a number of clubs are struggling to recruit sufficient players for the forthcoming season. My club is included in that list and I'm bemused and frustrated as to what else as a club we can do! On the edge of a large town offering a decent standard of league to play in we are failing to get enough new players through the door I thought I would write this to ask what are players looking for when they go to a club? And what are clubs doing to attract them? 1. Success breeds success - trophies has been a bit thin on the ground at holmans lately compared to the early/mid noughties. Does success attract players to a club?..of course but then we get into the chicken and an egg scenario to be successful you need a good talented squad but how can you start to get better results if you can't attract the players to achieve that! Do players need to stick with a club to build that good squad. Are they sometimes too quick to change teams when results are not going their way when in fact sticking at it could develop the team over a number of seasons into a solid unit. 2. Facilities - everyone likes a warm shower, decent pitch good changing rooms. Economically that's not always possible to create "world class stadia" in west Cornwall. Some clubs have fantastic facilities like Penryn & hayle but so do Penzance! Why are they struggling to recruit when they offer not only decent facilities but also a high standard of league to play in. It's not fair for me to mention some of the postage stamps and ploughed fields some people play on we all have our favourite places to play and then the ones where the hamstring injury kicks in because that afternoon will be spent on the side of a cliff on a sloping pitch in a gale force wind but fair play to those home sides they manage to field teams. What attracts the players to play on those types of pitches week in week out is it a team spirit and club pride. 3. Money - I'm not going down the line here of clubs paying players it's been covered countless times before and frankly the subject bores me! I'm talking match fees and everyday running costs. We charge £10 a month now from the players to cover ref expenses and kit etc we used to charge weekly but some players can dodge payments better then others (you know who you are!!! Lol) as a club we have had a debate over a couple of seasons by charging match fees are we discouraging players from joining compared to other sides who may not charge or give 'travelling expenses'. I think most clubs charge fees if not can you give me tips on your sponsorship because I can't see how they survive. A lot of players don't realise the costs to run a club are from insurance to league and cup entry fees to ref and pitch expenses £500 was our outlay this season just to get two sides on the pitch. 4. Atmosphere - this is the tricky one for me. Being slightly older I remember a fantastic drinking culture at the club I was at where the players would stay long after a game. Sometimes these days clubs tend to empty quite quickly...why? Is the costs involved in having a social beer after a game diluting team spirit or do players not really count the social part of football as a necessity these days. What can clubs do to encourage players to stay longer? We provide food, beer and sky sports I tried getting a stripper for after show entertainment but was a bit of a disaster when Matt the local painter and decorator turned up....bloody yellow pages I had better conclude this now before mr deacon bans me for using up to much megabyte space on the forum I know their is other arguments of playing with mates, travelling, locality, following the manager etc etc that is why I want to spark this debate and open it up to players of all abilities and the really valuable people who run all the clubs and ask them what do you do to attract players and as a player what attracts you to a club as I've tried all the usual methods and I'm frustrated and scratching my head at what else I can do. Ps holmans are training tonight 6:30 at blaythorne if anyone fancies giving it a go :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le boss Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 Sadly, football is not the be all and end all for lads anymore. Think its down to luck to a larger extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Marks Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 Neil i think to be fair at holmans theres still an influx of players that should of hung there boots up years ago but perhaps to keep the bar happy cans of coke from youngsters was not ideal. this is only my opinion and is not a dig at you fella in anyway, you wouldn't agree cos your to honest but without you, football at holmans would struggle to exist. Im not saying you haven't had youngsters and I'm not saying the club is rubbish i for one would love to return as combo manager and build a team for the future as i have openly admitted but i also feel that certain people at your club don't want it to change. i have ex holmans players back this season at titans 3 leagues below yourselves although to be fair they were at titans the previous season i think there gripe is the team was just not good enough so a different outlook from my perspective and they left only weeks ago. what do we say to that stick it out or maybe they weren't good enough? Holmans will be back strong again soon I'm sure but it is a shame to see better junior sides in camborne and redruth than holmans at this time and i am as much to blame as the next local manager However i want of course what is best for titans etc etc. Keep working your magic with the youngsters you have now neil and persevere where others don't :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pitty Posted August 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 Dave I agree on a lot of what you have said although I'm trying to get this topic on what attracts players to certain clubs I don't really want it to be about what issues holmans have. Like you have stated players have gone to titans 3 leagues below because they felt the team wasn't good enough.....how can players judge that before a ball has been kicked? Is that down to a managers persuasive personality or a lack of gumption on the parts of players to not stick at something and strive to achieve where it may be a challenge or take the easy route and play at a standard well within their talents in a big fish small pond scenario. The statement about better teams in junior football is a fair one although holmans did play a trelawny premier side and won 4-1 in pre season so we are maybe not the side many may portray us as. Are those junior sides good because the the players are not being over ambitious and striving to play at a level that they are capable of but which challenges their abilities! This brings me back to my original article on are players mainly interested in success and playing with their mates which lowers the standards of the supposedly better standard teams in higher placed leagues and lowers the standard of the leagues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Marks Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 Yes sorry not trying to make it a holmans thing? the premier side you beat will be the same won we beat 7-1 the week before ok ok that was naughty. Ok what attracts players to certain clubs well we have known for at least the last few years that mates are the biggest influence on where players play. some combo sides are playing mates that are worlds apart in terms of ability but if you upset the crap one your best one follows him out the door. At titans i try to play attractive football and sometimes that bites me back in the butt but i wouldn't change it to stand there and just lump it forward and see that for 90 mins. So that would be a huge attraction knowing I'm joining a side thats at least trying to play the game. The social side is as big a part as the game as far as I'm concerned the certain things that i have with a lot of help makes it a whole day and not just 90 mins see u later, none of this i hastened to add is pointed at holmans. We have certain games, m.o.m. awards etc etc some kept secret For me i like to enjoy my saturday from 12ish through to 7-8-9 o'clock . I know you know the score for afterwards. ps could be the manager :o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldeneye Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 There is just too much football! The combo supplementary cup final was on the 20th May and teams were starting pre-season training about 1 month later. Absolutely ridiculous!! How can you expect players to work up any enthusiasm for the new season with such a short break? There shoud be a 3 month break - season finishing by end of April - training and friendlies in August - league matches starting in September. Number of teams in the league adjusted to make this happen - also no replays in cup matches, all matches decided on the day. The current situation is a perfect example of the saying, 'more is less' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerrard8 Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 If we are talking about the camborne redruth area we have to use illogan as the benchmark club and its a club that creates a feel good factor starting from arriving at the ground which it really does have its identity as a football club,getting changed in a dressing room which i guarantee is prepared properly with warm-up t-shirts warm-up jackets and everything you need to prepare properly including a physio on hand,The pitch being 3 steps from the changing rooms is also a plus and a pitch surrounded with advertising boards gives the pitch a proper ground feel and the indroduction of a pa system which plays music during the warm-up and at half time has definitly added something to playing at oxland parc,after the game the clubhouse is adjacent to the changing rooms and in my opinion illogans club house which is always clean tidy and well presented is as good as any i have witnessed in cornish football.....and the facilities are the same for 2nd team which is why they can keep 25-30 combo level players at the club...........sorry if i sound like a promoter for illogan but thats what we are competing against in this area.....although i am no longer involved at the club i still feel its the best place for my lad as he starts out in mens football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le boss Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 We have a situation where a Combo club is promising players the earth and unfortunately young lads only hear the words "senior" and "combo" and think it is the promised land when in reality the standard of the team they are thinking about going to is very poor and they will end up getting beaten heavily most weeks and altho they have signed for us as a junior club we now have to apply to the so-called senior club with 7 days if they see sense!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Deacon Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 It'll be interesting to hear from some players on this debate. When you say a club "is promising players the earth" - what can those promises actually be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le boss Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 You and I know that they are hollow promises but youngsters can easily be swayed but once these teams have their names on the bit of paper, they find it difficult to get away and come back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isaac rosenberg Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 Well, for instance...... Large contracts to take off roofs unnecessarily and then put them back on again; access to an extensive network of sacrificial virgins; opportunities to make religious and political connections which promise everlasting bliss; help with academic coursework; relationship counselling; responsible adults well-placed to prevent alcoholic self-asphyxiation; absurd quantities of the demon drink, nepotistic selection opportunities for higher representative teams, good opposition for a friendly punch-up when bored, a suitable group of friends to make debt collection visits or ensure community justice, employment or a work permit, somewhere to live, vehicular transport, a little favour in relation to legal difficulties, hard cash. Or this is just what I've heard, you understand. Nothing like this would ever have been allowed in any organisation I have been connected with, though I did once need to get a celebrated striker's car off a dry-stone wall while wearing a bucket on my head. Later on he fell in the bucket. It is also a mistake to get on the wrong side of 18 stone potato pickers who claim to have played in centre mid for Boston United. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pitty Posted August 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 It'll be interesting to hear from some players on this debate. When you say a club "is promising players the earth" - what can those promises actually be? Exactly Dave this is what this topic is about asking players what they are looking for in a club to make them want to be a part of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minns Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 ill be there pitty :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokefan1 Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 i think this is a question a lot of teams ask, and i think truly theres just not enough players in the camborne redruth area so supply all the clubs with some clubs obviously having 1,2 or even 3 teams. Also some players success is a big thing a lot of players would rather be bit part player at successful team than get full games at a team who is not doing so well at whatever level, a lot of teams have bunches of friends so when one leaves the rest follow which can leave a club really in trouble normally they go to nanother local club not mattering what the standard aslong as they can play in same team as their friends and sometimes there allowed to dictate which team they play in just because clubs need players, i know plenty players who pick to play in second team when there good enough for first team football just because there mates play their! and when comes to combo teams promising youngsters everything sometimes true sometimes not i am a true believer in if your good enough your old enough however i also agree there is so many talented players playing junior football because the combination league is not as good as it was and people do not find it as advertising as it used to be people would rather play lower standard but enjoy it more by playing in friendship groups and under a manager they like and can have laugh with, this is why so many times you see if a manager changes clubs a bunch players follow him there dont matter if dropping divisions, but i also agree with gerrard8 illogan is the benchmark for all junior and senior clubs in the area the reason they keep there young talent is because the facilities, they have success through all teams and junior age groups and managers are classed as friends Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flo Rida Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 How can players attract clubs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokefan1 Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 flo rida where you from and what standard you looking to play at Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flo Rida Posted August 14, 2012 Report Share Posted August 14, 2012 flo rida where you from and what standard you looking to play at Im near st austell, but I dont know anything about the standard of each league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Professor Posted August 15, 2012 Report Share Posted August 15, 2012 A longer term solution would be having, or at least having a link to, a youth set-up. That's probably the best marketing you could undertake, as you could have potentially up to 8-10 years to sell your own club/team. My own youth experience was at Falmouth Town many years ago and it was absolutely brilliant. We played under the same name/colours as the men's 1st team, and we all went back to the clubhouse after our Sunday fixtures. This meant that the environment, and it's people, we're familiar to us when the time came to step up to senior football. The men's teams then benefitted from an influx of players every season. I suppose it was positive environment that was created that helped this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100%cornish Posted August 15, 2012 Report Share Posted August 15, 2012 Its all to do with money these days local pride is no more ,whoever pays the most money that player will go there .Its very upsetting what has happened to Penzance a lovely club with a lovely ground ran by really good people .I remember seeing so many good games down there and also the studio 10 tournament there when i used to catch the train from Newquay to get there to watch the likes of Robbie Fowler Jamie Redknapp etc .Hope they do pull through and dont get more hammerings like there 1st 2 games this club must survive . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheolderIgetthebetterIwas Posted August 15, 2012 Report Share Posted August 15, 2012 Well, for instance...... Large contracts to take off roofs unnecessarily and then put them back on again; access to an extensive network of sacrificial virgins; opportunities to make religious and political connections which promise everlasting bliss; help with academic coursework; relationship counselling; responsible adults well-placed to prevent alcoholic self-asphyxiation; absurd quantities of the demon drink, nepotistic selection opportunities for higher representative teams, good opposition for a friendly punch-up when bored, a suitable group of friends to make debt collection visits or ensure community justice, employment or a work permit, somewhere to live, vehicular transport, a little favour in relation to legal difficulties, hard cash. Or this is just what I've heard, you understand. Nothing like this would ever have been allowed in any organisation I have been connected with, though I did once need to get a celebrated striker's car off a dry-stone wall while wearing a bucket on my head. Later on he fell in the bucket. It is also a mistake to get on the wrong side of 18 stone potato pickers who claim to have played in centre mid for Boston United. Hello Issac. Not much poetry again, I bet you just love reading your own witterings. I think you will find most will just flick over your nonsense, but I will persevere so you do not feel alone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gareth Posted August 16, 2012 Report Share Posted August 16, 2012 It's about player retention as much as attracting others and I'd guess to achieve that is making the club look attractive and embracing the matchday, I'm not an expert but perhaps a club shirt and tie, themed weeks/night's out, having a "happy bus" for away games, fines, charity events, get yourself amongst the community/media etc....The best thing about matchday (besides playing) is the craic and banter in the dressing room and club house before and after. You need to harness this feel good factor and spread it amongst the squad, revitalising the social side et al. Communication with the youth side, making it an easy transition, some 15-16 year olds initially find mens football daunting, assure them it isn't (suppose you have to retain the youth first before tackling that!). Chuck a few posters up, update your website, promote the clubhouse, happy hours, free pool. Isn't there a charity day coming up on the 26th August at Holmans, plenty of people/players will be there that day, seize the day (literally)!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippy Posted August 16, 2012 Report Share Posted August 16, 2012 There is just too much football! The combo supplementary cup final was on the 20th May and teams were starting pre-season training about 1 month later. Absolutely ridiculous!! How can you expect players to work up any enthusiasm for the new season with such a short break? There shoud be a 3 month break - season finishing by end of April - training and friendlies in August - league matches starting in September. Number of teams in the league adjusted to make this happen - also no replays in cup matches, all matches decided on the day. The current situation is a perfect example of the saying, 'more is less' Spot on Goldeneye - the Combo clubs have the dubious distinction of playing more fixtures than any other step 7 feeder league in the land! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pitty Posted August 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2012 Some great comments Gareth and I agree on all the points you raised and I think it's probably what all clubs try to achieve however it's very easy to state a utopia of creating a great club to attract players but can still be difficult to achieve with maybe a lack of numbers and finance Do you not think some of the things you mentioned need to come from the players themselves and this is getting back to when players used to be proud of the club they played for and would go out of their way to create an atmosphere organise social events and actually engage with each other following a match no matter what the result. The hardworking people who run all these clubs without exception wil always try to do their best for their club members and put into place the basic requirements of kit, league entry training etc Reading through the thread you are one of the only players compared to managers/secretaries outside observers to have had an input into this thread! Does this indicate players are not really fussed or interested about the wider aspects of the club they play for and are just happy to turn up kick a ball about for 90min then have a quick beer then go home I think this would be rather sad if it was true and I'm sure it's not but have we reached the point where their is just to many clubs making it easy for players to move on at any time if they are not happy with something diluting that feeling of togetherness and team spirit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isaac rosenberg Posted August 16, 2012 Report Share Posted August 16, 2012 In the words of Jessie J and of the woman in "Titanic", why so serious, theolderI...... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Keane is GOD!!! Posted August 16, 2012 Report Share Posted August 16, 2012 I believe isaacs mutterings are better left in the trenches! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isaac rosenberg Posted August 16, 2012 Report Share Posted August 16, 2012 Spent about a decade in those metaphorical trenches, dealing with the awful provincialism and small mindedness of parish pump football politics. Raised around sixty grand and contributed about twenty. Under my chairmanship a remote club on its way into junior football, deserted by a former manager and 13 players who went to Penzance on the eve of the season, won two senior trophies and has consistemtly got to a top six position since. Of course it took money and time; and some players provide better value for both than others. But credit goes to the inspirational Steve Curnow and a couple of other loyal club members. I care deeply about the issues in this thread, but know from the ups and downs of fanatically loving a club that if I couldn't laugh about these issues I'd cry. Snideness from those who have only been around since August 2012 lacks the historical perspective to judge me. I wish Pitty well in his search as there's nobody around whose club loyalty exceeds his or mine. Good luck to all "wherever green is worn." (poetry, albeit Irish and out of context). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Eddy Posted August 16, 2012 Report Share Posted August 16, 2012 perhaps you need to make your club more attractive to players. have qualified coaches take training. make people welcome when they first come to your club,even introduce them to others. make sure your facilities are clean and tidy. encourage spectators,some of these may want to become involved in the running of the club,if only to make tea/coffee at half-time. most importantly if you are a senior club then make sure that anybody coming to your clubs knows it. all of these things describe illogan fc BUT to get all of these things you need a good band of volunteers happiness breeds sucess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Mead Posted August 16, 2012 Report Share Posted August 16, 2012 An Interesting attempt to get the answer we all seek Pitty! I share many of the views expressed - although none have yet revealed the secret !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldeneye Posted August 17, 2012 Report Share Posted August 17, 2012 I think the only answer is to follow the American Football example, with each club having a dozen cheerleaders gyrating on the touchline! Might help to attract a few players. :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pitty Posted August 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2012 I think the only answer is to follow the American Football example, with each club having a dozen cheerleaders gyrating on the touchline! Might help to attract a few players. Finally the answer we have all been striving for . I'm sure some of the local camborne girls will be up for that.........Hang on i did say we wanted to attract players not scare them away ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isaac rosenberg Posted August 17, 2012 Report Share Posted August 17, 2012 Go on, breed the team of the future. There's nothing else to do in the winter down St Just except round up stray bullocks and wreck a few ships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldeneye Posted August 17, 2012 Report Share Posted August 17, 2012 I've heard that it's so boring down St Just that the residents often congregate on the pavement to watch the traffic lights change! :yahoo: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheolderIgetthebetterIwas Posted August 17, 2012 Report Share Posted August 17, 2012 In the words of Jessie J and of the woman in "Titanic", why so serious, theolderI...... ? Serious? you think I'm serious, I've been around longer than August 12 and have been in meetings with you. You were banned from representing your club the last one I attended, also banned from the forum and banned from PZs ground!!!! what does that tell you. Nothing in your case because you just cannot stop when you have a point to prove. Snideness, not at all, merely pointing out when your wittering and trying to romanticise everything. Take a step back, come down a few rungs and throw away your 4 million word dictionary, just use the Oxford. Your enthusiasum for your club is commendable - just tad over the top on occasions. You appear to have a modicum of intelligence, so use it. Nobody can attract players, the monies gone, combined with to much football, its the start to the reduction in local football. A few teams will fold this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isaac rosenberg Posted August 17, 2012 Report Share Posted August 17, 2012 Unfortunately, your answer illustrates why so many natives with half a brain find a need to leave Cornwall. I'm gad you implicitly recognise that I have valid points to make, even if you cannot comprehend them in an articulate form. To be "banned" by the self-appointed rustic intelligentsia of the three bodies you list, primrarily because I have the had the courage to speak truth about their rule-breakings,ditherings or moral nconsistencies is a mark of distinction. I love to answer fools according to their folly. My resultant suffering has been minimal. Christ was crucified for less. Cornish football would not have appreciated Him either. I am not prepared to join the bumbling majority of never-weres who collude dully with evil. Your reference to Oxford puzzles me, as my undergraduate experience did not,as you seem to imply, diminish my vocabulary. While I would be delighted to debate various threads of European Romamticism with you, having taught them at university level, I doubt that many readers of this forum share your fundamental misunderstanding of the term "romantic". However, if you would like some confidential and supportive assistance with apostrophes, pronouns or pluralisation of nouns, do get in touch. I'll be pleased to help. Your attempt to patronise me is about as justifiable as Satan turning up at Nazareth with a pack of Pampers and a bottle of colic medicine. For clarification, I am Rod Beer, a Tinner fanatic and proud of it. Are you going to come out from behinf your dirty raincoat ? Thought not. Last two clauses of your posting might be right. However, amid our mutual difficulties, what I despise is that some of the most complacent, badly run clubs,with the backing of the usual media and administrative parasites, behave as though they have a god-given greater right to survive by poachng players from others. In their favour, the rules mysteriously change. It is reminiiscent of the behaviour of some USA client states in relation to "extraordinary rendition". Whwn imperialist powers sweep through subordinated territories periodically, it is understandable that those with a memory of subjugation resent them. Yet despite that, whenever Penzance FC asked me for a donation, I never refused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
isaac rosenberg Posted August 17, 2012 Report Share Posted August 17, 2012 Traffic lights. Goldeneye ! New fangled devil's playthings ! We prefer russian roulette with fayther's blunderbuss ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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