How do you judge a 'good' player?

[4-4-2]

I speak to a lot of respected people in the game who seem to have lots of knowledge and experience, and quite often when we discuss a player they judge how good they are by what they have won. Not always, but often i'll hear, 'yeah he wasn't bad, didn't win anything though' or 'he thinks he's better than he is, if he was that good why has he never won anything'. I know that most good players go on to win leagues and cups in a career, but surely some players can be unlucky? Or can they? Or some players could be loyal to just 1 club and miss out that way? Just wondered what other people's views on this is?

[Johnno]

Not saying I was a quality player but im sure I would of won a lot more if I was not so loyal.

[Lafs]

Very interesting topic 4-4-2 and a discussion im sure we have all been caught up in at some point or another.

Naturally honours and a trophy cabinet bursting with silverware would suggest a player was or is top draw, but would that mean Alan Shearer wasnt a top draw player as he only managed ONE winners medal in his career?! Maybe a case of being unlucky or making the wrong career move.

My cousin Jason Cundy started off with Chelsea and captained England U21's before moving to Spurs and having his career cut short early by multiple injuries and then Testicular Cancer- therefore never claiming any honours ect.

Or even Mathew Le Tissier?? A player who remained loyal to the Saints, rejecting offers from Chelsea and AC Milan.

More locally, how about Wayne Quinn? Could anyone suggest he wasnt a success or a good player just because he maybe didnt win honours on a regular basis at the peak of his career?

As I said its an interesting one but in my opinion a player cannot be judged on his success or honours alone.

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

Lafs was a good player until some Hungarian International playing for Plymouth Argyle Youth team sliced through his ankle.

A good player is one that performs consistantly over a long period, The old Arsenal back four, Gerrard, Terry, Giggs, they are all players you would love to have in your team for obvious reasons. Locally and this only applies to players I have watched over the years, then Ash Bradshaw ( nearly forgot our player of the year 2 seasons ago and Luke Rigby who has been excellent for 2 seasons), Shaun Middleton and Sam McKune have to be classed as 'good' players. This season, it has to be Paul Hampshire, absolute quality !

[Mr Cornwall]

Lafs was a good player until some Hungarian International playing for Plymouth Argyle Youth team sliced through his ankle.

A good player is one that performs consistantly over a long period, The old Arsenal back four, Gerrard, Terry, Giggs, they are all players you would love to have in your team for obvious reasons. Locally and this only applies to players I have watched over the years, then Ash Bradshaw ( nearly forgot our player of the year 2 seasons ago and Luke Rigby who has been excellent for 2 seasons), Shaun Middleton and Sam McKune have to be classed as 'good' players. This season, it has to be Paul Hampshire, absolute quality !

totally agree newquay have got quality players. they gave callington an absolutely cracking game in the cup and congrats hope with the team u got they shud be in the final of the charity cup. and paul hampshire has been instrumental in the midfield. as every squad needs, competition for every place, i can see newquay being in the top 4, but winning against port and penzance well worthy of top 3.

I speak to a lot of respected people in the game who seem to have lots of knowledge and experience, and quite often when we discuss a player they judge how good they are by what they have won. Not always, but often i'll hear, 'yeah he wasn't bad, didn't win anything though' or 'he thinks he's better than he is, if he was that good why has he never won anything'. I know that most good players go on to win leagues and cups in a career, but surely some players can be unlucky? Or can they? Or some players could be loyal to just 1 club and miss out that way? Just wondered what other people's views on this is?

totally agree with your comments, at the end of the day it takes a squad and a team of 11 to win trophies together rather than 1 person.

[sven gordan (eric's son!)]

a good player in my eyes is someone who wins honors and someone who can adapt to many positions without looking out of place.

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

Honours only means that a player was in a good team that won stuff, you can't tell me that JS PARK of ManUre would get into any other Prem top half side, he is only there to sell shirts and sponsorship deals to the Far East ! He may have the medals, but a good player ?

There are plenty of better players who have won little or nothing, Shearer won almost naff all, but clubs including ManUre were desperate to buy him, Matt Le Tiss performed for Soton year after year (ok he was a genius and only needed to play at 100% for 5mins a game to produce a match winning performance). Glenn Hoddle was a master but won little.

As I siad previosuly, medals don't make you good, consistancy does, a player will gain respect from all concerned for being the man who gives his all for your club over the years.

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

Fair point, we all have our own opinions and that is what the forum is all about.

[Guest Cornishdave1980]

A fine topic which wil divide us all.

I agree with The Judge, honours do not guarentee the quality of a player.

I have to disagree with Sven, in the sense that a good player is versitile.......Alan Shearer could only play up front but god he was good......Paulo Maldini was an excellent left back but never ventured far from that position.

Some requirements of a good player should be

natural ability

consistency (over career)

Team ethics

Winning Mentality

Attitude

Im interested to see what other think are suitable attributes

[Guest little dave]

just go and watch dan chapman :D

[bigtony!]

now there`s a great player!!

[4-4-2]

I guess it is an argument that people will have many very different views on. Who is Dan Chapman? Who does he play for?

[bigtony!]

he`s a torpoint lad,spent a couple of years at man utd as a youngter,he reckon`s he was wes browns room mate.

[offside!]

And now he's playing for Torpoint?

[Guest little dave]

dan chapman for england!!!!!!!!!! have to shave that beerd though. is this really dan chapman at xmas????

[Guest Peppermint]

Honours only means that a player was in a good team that won stuff, you can't tell me that JS PARK of ManUre would get into any other Prem top half side, he is only there to sell shirts and sponsorship deals to the Far East ! He may have the medals, but a good player ?

There are plenty of better players who have won little or nothing, Shearer won almost naff all, but clubs including ManUre were desperate to buy him, Matt Le Tiss performed for Soton year after year (ok he was a genius and only needed to play at 100% for 5mins a game to produce a match winning performance). Glenn Hoddle was a master but won little.

As I siad previosuly, medals don't make you good, consistancy does, a player will gain respect from all concerned for being the man who gives his all for your club over the years.

The Judge's comments.

Sorry Mark[The Judge] but after yesterday I could not resist posting a reply to the above posting.

Sometimes things come back to haunt you and in the United/Chelsea game Mr Park despite what you said looked much more of a class player than Mr Lampard etc.

If he sells shirts then that is good for the Club but he is a bit better than you give him credit for - at least he looked as if he wanted to win the game!!!!