Some unwanted attendance figures

[DanBlazey]

Still the SWPL attendance figures drop as fans show their true feelings about this league.

A recent midweek league game between Bodmin and Clyst was watched by just THIRTY spectators. I find this figure absolutely incredible as Bodmin are on their way to the title.

Just a few days before that, the league match between Clyst and high flying Saltash set a new SWPL Premier record low of 28.

The old SWL could pride itself for many years on the fact that the teams were the best supported for their level in the country.

These new figures show that the new SWPL is attracting the similar poor crowds seen at step six in other part of the country.

Worrying times for the league and its member clubs.

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

It is clear, that Bodmin fans only turn out when they are playing another Cornish side, a quick look on

http://www.tonykempster.co.uk/swpatt.htm , confirms this. Do they want to watch good football or just local football ? Yes crowds will be bigger for local matches but to be fair, their average this season is up 2.5% on last season.

Blazey are losing out due to the relative success of St Austell this season but Porthlevens crowds are down by 30.9% despite being top of the league, has this got anything to do with not wanting promotion ?

Div 1 West crowds for those who have applied for promotion are all up, even though they may not get the ground grading or win the league. However, those in the Prem with traditional good support, Blazey, Falmouth and Saltash are all down on last season.

There are many and varied reasons for these figures no doubt, but I don't think anyone would argue that local games attract bigger crowds regardless of what Div or where you are in the league. Does this mean we should call for a Cornwall Senior League with Combo & ECPL as our own Divs 1 W/E ? I personally don't think we should. The argument for increased 'travelling expenses' is not as large as some think. For those who have applied to go up from Div 1 West there will be only 6 games in the Prem that go further than Plm/Ivy, nothing to worry about there then, PZ will obviously notice the difference but surely getting to Newton Abbott now is easier than back in the 50-60's.

[Guest sonny jim]

The biggest drop in averages seems to be the mighty St Blazey with a drop of over 29%, how can a club survive with such a fair weather crowd??

mmmmm

[Guest]

How insular can anyone be. Dartmouth + 37.4%, Tavistock +30.7, Buckland + 22.6, Ivybridge +14.0, Newton Abbot Spurs +8.5 and Holsworthy +4.2. Seems fine in Devon must be a Cornish problem

I checked out the SWPL Premier table and what a surprise - out of the top seven clubs five are from Devon. Perhaps the premier division is proving a bit tough for some of the more establsihed Cornish teams.

It just shows what a great success the SWPL is. Stop knocking and enjoy A little competition does not hurt anyone.

Oh! and the average premier division crowds compared to this time last season is down by just 1 fan per game. What a shocking statistic and we are even in a recession.

Keep taking the happy pills and enjoy the rest of the season.

And I just checked the West and East divisions. West attendances up 19% and East up 8.7%. Sounds like a pretty good success story to me.

[Dave Deacon]

how can a club survive with such a fair weather crowd??

Football fans have always been fickle! But I have to say could some of the crowd numbers dropping off is that the standard of football is very disappointing.

And, dare I say it, but the refereeing isn't helping. "Inconsistency" and "non-contact sport" springs to mind!

:SM_carton_y:

[DanBlazey]

The biggest drop in averages seems to be the mighty St Blazey with a drop of over 29%, how can a club survive with such a fair weather crowd??

mmmmm

And Parkway brought how many to Blazey the other week? Five was it?

How insular can anyone be. Dartmouth + 37.4%, Tavistock +30.7, Buckland + 22.6, Ivybridge +14.0, Newton Abbot Spurs +8.5 and Holsworthy +4.2. Seems fine in Devon must be a Cornish problem

I checked out the SWPL Premier table and what a surprise - out of the top seven clubs five are from Devon. Perhaps the premier division is proving a bit tough for some of the more establsihed Cornish teams.

It just shows what a great success the SWPL is. Stop knocking and enjoy A little competition does not hurt anyone.

Oh! and the average premier division crowds compared to this time last season is down by just 1 fan per game. What a shocking statistic and we are even in a recession.

Keep taking the happy pills and enjoy the rest of the season.

And I just checked the West and East divisions. West attendances up 19% and East up 8.7%. Sounds like a pretty good success story to me.

ECPL - thanks for your post.

I'm not sure you read most of my posts.

I am, and always have been, behind the SWPL because it was the only way to move forward from stagnating South Western League.

If you read my post again, I wasn't having a pop at the SWPL; if I didn't like it, would I be travelling to the likes of Dartmouth, Newton Abbot and Clyst every week?! No. I'm loving the big away days in Devon.

Getting back to the original point of this thread, it has to be very worrying that Bodmin, champions elect, can only attract 30 through the gate for a midweek league game.

[Guest Uncle Albert]

Wasn't the Bodmin v Clyst game played on the night when there were big Champions League games on the box; the Junior Cup east final at Liskeard; and the Senior Cup semi-final at Wadebridge?

I'm not trying to make any excuses for the poor support at Bodmin - just looking for reasons for such a low turnout on that night. There were probably more people in the Bodmin clubhouse watching the big games on the tv.

Despite their fantastic season on the field, Bodmin are struggling off it. Yesterday the chairman had to man the entrance booth because nobody else at the club seemed prepared to do it.

Sadly, Bodmin are not 'supported' by the people of Bodmin, for whatever reason. his is not a new scenario, it has been going on for years. The crowds they do get are made up mostly of relatives and friends of the players.

[DanBlazey]

An afterthought:

Just been on to Kempster's site myself and this is what I found.

Attendances for the following clubs are DOWN:

Plymouth Parkway

Cullompton Rangers

Witheridge

Elburton Villa

Clyst Rovers

Attendances for the following clubs are UP:

Torpoint Athletic

Bodmin Town

Lanson

Wadebridge Town

So your Cornwall v Devon argument doesn't really hold water here mate.

The only two significant drops are St Blazey and Falmouth Town, and that has nothing to do with Devon v Cornwall, that has to do with Truro City Football Club (and to some extent Snozzle for us and maybe even Penryn for Falmouth??)

You can read whatever you like into figures, the fact of the matter is that I have been to virtually every Devon ground this season, and one word has been used repeatedly to describe all of them (with exception of Buckland): EMPTY!

The away St Blazey support virtually matched the home support at Holsworthy, Dartmouth, Cullompton and Clyst. At Buckland, the Blazey support made up about a third of the crowd.

[Paul]

Its easy to have crowds attendances up!! Ask Holsworthy as when we travelled there, there were barly 50-60 in the ground. The crowd came out at 96 i believe!! Not a chance!!

So if our Chairman could please declare a 4,000 sell out for Wadebridge on wednesday night well be sorted!!!

Having travelled to all but four away games this season, i can only agree with Dan on the poor crowds. Yesterday was very sad. I expect once you take out club officials, there were barly 30 there!!

Still, im certainly not complaining about our long trips. Nice to see new clubs and i look forward to Withy on saturday. :D

[Guest]

You have lost me on this one. Plymouth Parkway this season 181, 2007/8 181. That tells me the attendcances are the same.

The Liskeard gate hasn't been shown yet, but Parkway have still to play, Bodmin, Buckland, Saltash and Tavistock, all local high gate matches.

Cullompton have had off field problems. I think the money almost ran out at Witheridge who have had a poor season and lets be fair they are a small village. Elburton Villa are bottom of the league so their attendcances have stood up well and they still have some lucrative matches to play. Clyst are another team in the middle of nowhere and have done well to keep going without any money.

Torpoint have a very good home record and deserve to have increased their gates. We are told Bodmins gates are low but they have actually gone up. Launceston have increased by one spectator per game harldy a gate crashing achievement. Wadebridge have done well and have some money spinning matches to come.

I will agree with you about the Truro factor but saying that Falmouth have had a dreadful season. Saltash have had a good season so far but their gates are down St Blazey aren't the force they were simply because the money has gone. Liskeard have had a poor season to date but are only slightly down, likewise Hoslworthy but their gates are up.

We can all make what we like out of statistics but i still go back to your central point in that

'Still the SWPL attendance figures drop as fans show their true feelings about this league'. That is nonsense as the gates are virtually the same as last season.

Your other statement was ''These new figures show that the new SWPL is attracting the similar poor crowds seen at step six in other part of the country. Worrying times for the league and its member clubs.". I'm sorry but the league is doing fine it is just certain clubs whose plight can be easily answered that are causing problems.

Again I have checked the Step 6 clubs and of the 14 leagues the SWPL gates are in most cases double those step 6 leagues apart from the North East Division One and they are almost exactly the same.

I say it again. The SWPL has no problems whatsoever and compared with the rest of the country they are doing just fine. Stop knocking what is a very good league.

[Home Waters]

And Parkway brought how many to Blazey the other week? Five was it?

In fact there were 20 supporters of parkway there - whilst thats not many for us, the second team had their only game at home under the lights that night and a number of people were there for various reasons.

What I did find strange for St.Blazey was that I counted only seven Blazey supporters behind the goal, there used to be loads morel I counted 65 in the ground :SM_carton_y:

[Paul]

20 Parkway fans at St Blazey!! Not a chance!!!

There arnt so many behind the goal these days but then again, how many clubs have anyone behind the goal???

And i dont no what the crowd was but stil more atmosphere than most grounds to!! :D

[DanBlazey]

ECPL - read my posts!! I'm not knocking it!! But nobody can deny that the crowds are poor compared to the old SWL.

There are plenty of people who write on this board who are against the league, so have a go at them, not me!

Why are you trying to pick a fight with someone who essentially agrees with you?! That for me defines "insular"!

Home Waters - I stand corrected, although you 20 were very quiet on the night!! I mentioned to your keeper that you have over 200 fans a game, and he said "no, over 200 come to watch us, not support us" which I thought was quite revealing, but it's still good revenue for the club I guess.

You're right about our hardcore "behind the goal" support which has been down to as low as about seven for some games this season. I can remember days when the support stretched from corner flag to corner flag. Tough times.

[MOUNTAINEER]

Dan Bailey,

Good on you for supporting the SWPL, those attendances are a concern, unfortunately it is a national problem, last week I went through Berkhampsted (Tuesday) on the way to Luton Airport, there on GREEN BELT land hundreds of kids were playing rugby and football, they were from schools in the local and surrounding area, in all there were about 12 pitches, all those kids playing sport but Berkhampsted MENS team disbanded recently because of finance. As I travel around the Southern League watching Truro City it is noticable that those keeping the clubs afloat (running things) are the older generation, not many youngsters attend games these days.

South West Peninsula Premier League RECORD LOW ATTENDANCE

Last Season:- Newton Abbot Spurs v Ivybridge attracted only 27 (Tony Kempster site figure).

During Truro City's 2006/07 Western League Div I season Clyst's highest gate was against Truro 78

their season average was 33 and the lowest just 12 against Clevedon United, Bridport and Hengrove Athletic.

Clyst's attendances appeared to improve last season but now they look as if they are back to square one.

Some teams in the London Area post attendances as low as 5, others don't bother and stick in a 0.

I meet many people because of sport, those who stay at home bored don't know what they are missing, you obviously enjoy your sport and the company you keep, good luck.

[DanBlazey]

Mountaineer,

thanks for the post, I stand corrected on the SWPL low attendance record - really should do my research!

I agree, we should all get behind local football and give it our support. I follow my local team home and away and am saddened by those who have stopped doing so for whatever reason.

Just for the record, the correct spelling is DanBlazey.

Cheers.

[Guest Man on the Post]

DanBlazey, you mention that one of the reasons for low attendances is Truro City. Is there evidence that attendances are higher when Truro City are playing away? :D

[DanBlazey]

Probably not - maybe just a handful (can't be bothered to look it up to be honest).

Most that we lost to Truro were not the hardcore support anyway, so would be unlikely to come to St Blazey when Truro aren't at home (that's if they have any money left after paying EIGHT POUNDS to watch Truro!!)

Most that I know of that left haven't showed their faces once at Blaize Park since they "switched" - probably too ashamed. Being a glory supporter is not something to be proud of.

[Mike Odgers]

Falmouth gates down by 26% (120 average last season to 88 this) -I suppose it is better than expected considering the shambolic season.

Without a win in the last 6 league home games only 2 goals scored and next at Bickland will be leaders Bodmin on Wednesday.

Hoping that only one gets relegated and it will all depend on the home/away basement battle with Elburton Villa.

[Guest]

Sorrt DanBlazey I don't wish to labour the point but how many times do I have to read your postings to tell me that quite frankly it is knocking the SWPL. I suggest you look at what you originally posted. I like many others are dissapointed that the complaints about the SWPL all come from Cornwall. And how on earth can we compare the SWL gates with the SWPL when there were no figures.

With all due respect these are your statements.

'Still the SWPL attendance figures drop as fans show their true feelings about this league'

''These new figures show that the new SWPL is attracting the similar poor crowds seen at step six in other part of the country. Worrying times for the league and its member clubs.".

And yes - you are knocking the league and its a shame.

[DanBlazey]

Sorrt DanBlazey I don't wish to labour the point but how many times do I have to read your postings to tell me that quite frankly it is knocking the SWPL. I suggest you look at what you originally posted. I like many others are dissapointed that the complaints about the SWPL all come from Cornwall. And how on earth can we compare the SWL gates with the SWPL when there were no figures.

With all due respect these are your statements.

1) 'Still the SWPL attendance figures drop as fans show their true feelings about this league'

2) ''These new figures show that the new SWPL is attracting the similar poor crowds seen at step six in other part of the country. Worrying times for the league and its member clubs.".

3) And yes - you are knocking the league and its a shame.

1) I have spoken to countless numbers of people who hate the league and all the extra travelling involved.

2) If you think the league and its officers are OK with attendances in the 20s, 30s or 40s for ANY SWPL(P) game, that is your opinion, but you will be alone with it. A league officer (not saying who) recently told me that he thought attendances were extremely disappointing and that "given what St Blazey have achieved in recent years, they should be getting 3-400 a game". His words, not mine.

3) I challenge you to find any post where I am against the league. On the contrary, I have, on numerous occasions, expressed my support for the league

I reiterate one last time that the league officers will not think the league is "doing just fine" with attendances of 28 or 30 recorded.

ECPL - I have kept my posts to you both respectful and of a gentlemanly nature in the face of imbecile comments like "keep taking the happy pills". You are doing yourself and the excellent league your name represents absolutely no favours with your posts.

On a few occasions now, you have replied to my posts, which are always non-confrontational, in an unnecessarily confrontational manner. I can't fathom a reason for it except to question whether they are perhaps borne out of a hatred and jealously of Cornwall's most successful club over the past decade, St Blazey.

I shall waste no further time nor energy responding to your posts. I am interested in corresponding with people who wish to improve the profile of football in Cornwall, not people who want petty squabbles.

These are hard times for local football in this region (a fact you seem blissfully unaware of), so let's all pull together to make sure ALL the local leagues are a success.

Best regards,

Dan Hazelton, proud supporter of local football.

[Home Waters]

20 Parkway fans at St Blazey!! Not a chance!!!

Paul - I can give you all their names if you like - you must accept sometimes that a lot of people on this web come on just to give a fact or put one right - not neccessarily to score points off each other. :SM_carton:

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

I'm sure Bodmin are disappointed with the 30 crowd but I would suggest it is a problem unique to them in that over half the fans stayed at home to watch Euro footy. I was in the Bodmin clubhouse watching a Chelsea game midweek some years ago, Bodmin were top of the old SWL and Liskeard either 2nd or 3rd and there were about 30 in the ground and double that watching the TV in the clubhouse.

We at Newquay generally suffer to a lesser extent when TV games for Man U, Chels or Liverpool are on, possibly 10-12 go awol, although I would suggest that Tues 7th April will be a tough call for those waverers when St Austell come to MW.

I still think that fans prefer 'local' games but will also turn out for matches that matter. Bodmin are winning the SWPL and Clyst wouldn't be a big tempter for those 'armchair' fans.

I'm happy to support the SWPL but dread to think what will happen at the end of next season when Step 6 clubs have to comply with ground gradings or face automatic relegation as instructed by the FA. If this year is already farcical in that clubs won't know until after all games have finished who may go up/down, how on earth will they cope next season ? The situation is already in place this season for most leagues and causing fans and clubs all sorts of problems (see Tony Kempsters forum).

[MOUNTAINEER]

The Football Association appear to be dragging their feet where the grass roots clubs are concerned, all clubs, even those with wealthy backers are feeling the pinch, I don't think there has been a peep from footballs ruling body for a bail out plan and it is unlikely there will be one.

As mentioned previously on this thread the ground grading is an unwelcome event at this time.

During these difficult times, the FA should abandon the ground grading for a year or two, see if the countries economy still blights smaller clubs and act sensibly to find a solution.

For a country sporting the world's wealthiest league system everything has got top heavy, even the media, the media moguls only bother with non league to fill a vacant space when the big boys can't come out to play, the grass roots breeding ground for tomorrows talent gets forgotten, why knowing the plight of the little clubs do the media not highlight the desperate situation of almost every club in the land, money.

If the talk shows on Sky, Setanta, ITV and BBC etc. collectively issued an advertisement type appeal, eventually the message may get through, attendances at local level could double, most low attendances result from people getting into the comfort zone by staying at home, they only need a nudge, once meeting old friends over a pint they get hooked back at the club they know they really belong to.

________________________________________________________________________

DanBlazey :- SORRY for getting your name wrong, pure accident.I don't think you criticise the SWPL,

I understand your disappointment about attendances.

[Guest]

I'm sorry if gently pulling you up on a couple of points you raised has annoyed you. I've tried to keep the discussion non confrontational and factual. If that displeases you I'm genuinely sorry. For saying I'm an imbecile for a throw away joke like 'taking the happy pills' is a little outrageous to say the least I am now according to you - having a hatred towards St Blazey. How bizarre is that.

I didn't post your original comments you did. Perhaps you didn't mean what you wrote The fact is you wrote them not me. I will not insult you with unessesary remarks towards you, if you want to stoop that low then that is up to you. I can only suggest one thing and that is when you are in a hole stop digging. I trust this ends our little discussion

[Guest]

Just had a quick look at the Western League premier attendances and they are well below SWPL. Keep it going well done the SWPL.