St Blazey attendance versus Witheridge

[DanBlazey]

Last Saturday, the official attendance against Witheridge was 53. This is the lowest since the new league came into being, and I reckon the lowest crowd I have seen since I started watching St Blazey in '98.

Sad times indeed.

[hammers]

Danblazey,

do not worry old pall you would have a job to reach 50 at some of the Falmouth games,

so keep your chin up mate it can only get better,

Hammers :c:

[chairman]

lowest Falmouth home attendance so far this year = 56 against Torpoint and their average 87 compared with S.B.83.

Lot of work required by both clubs methinks.

[Paul]

Not good news at all. The lack of interest this season has been very disapointing. The core support especially away from home has been very good as usual but for some reason alot of our support haven stayed in the clubhouse on match days. Time to think of something to bring in the floaters!!! :unsure:

[Adlestrop]

Would it be too controversal to suggest a return to the old South Western League might do the trick?

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

What difference does the old SWL have over the SWPL Prem ? Both involve clubs from Devon & Cornwall, unless of course you mean scrap the 2 lower Divisions and bring in the likes of PZ, Port, St Austell and Newquay (4 of the current top 5 in the West) and dump some of the Devon clubs.

Is it, that some clubs are declaring gates officially lower than the actual attendance ? I know one club who actually reverted back to the (almost) correct attendance after reading the SWPL website. It states, that all persons who watch (other than players, refs and tea bar staff etc) have to be counted regardless of wether they paid to get in or not. So if you include kids who get in free and club officials/committee, perhaps the actual attendances at St Blazey and Falmouth are actually higher.

I still support the SWPL despite some differences of opinion with those at HQ, if we revert back, there is no doubt, that the SWL would be placed at Level 7 and that would mean no FA Cup for those who are currently in the Prem Div. Trust me, the potential revenue and trips away for clubs and fans would be sorely missed.

If your home support has faltered, it will be due to the lack of success that both clubs are used to, the loyal support will stay with you regardless.

[Paul]

We certainly dont want to go back and have a league where no one goes up and down. Ok, it might not happen now for a while as the leagues really gets going but it must happen in order to improve the standards. Things will improve, sadly weve had nothing to play for, for months so to expect good crowds is silly. The fans will be back im sure. :blink:

[DanBlazey]

What difference does the old SWL have over the SWPL Prem ? Both involve clubs from Devon & Cornwall, unless of course you mean scrap the 2 lower Divisions and bring in the likes of PZ, Port, St Austell and Newquay (4 of the current top 5 in the West) and dump some of the Devon clubs.

1) Is it, that some clubs are declaring gates officially lower than the actual attendance ? I know one club who actually reverted back to the (almost) correct attendance after reading the SWPL website. It states, that all persons who watch (other than players, refs and tea bar staff etc) have to be counted regardless of wether they paid to get in or not. So if you include kids who get in free and club officials/committee, perhaps the actual attendances at St Blazey and Falmouth are actually higher.

2) I still support the SWPL despite some differences of opinion with those at HQ, if we revert back, there is no doubt, that the SWL would be placed at Level 7 and that would mean no FA Cup for those who are currently in the Prem Div. Trust me, the potential revenue and trips away for clubs and fans would be sorely missed.

If your home support has faltered, it will be due to the lack of success that both clubs are used to, the loyal support will stay with you regardless.

1) Is there any reason why clubs would do that? I'm pretty sure, however, that some clubs are announcing higher than their official attendance: Holsworthy v St Blazey being a case in point. A few old men with their dogs on the touchline plus the travelling Blazey support of 20, and somehow they came up with a figure of 96!!

2) Probably the only point I agree with you on Mr Judge. I think we have to support it don't we? It's all we've got! :c:

[The Professor]

During these difficult economic times, I think clubs at this level could really exploit the fact that football fans in the region may not be able to afford to go and watch a higher level of football (e.g. Plymouth Argyle, Torquay United or Exeter City). In addition, many debates have raged concerning the fact that football clubs and their players are more detached from their fans as they ever have been.

SWPL clubs could 'market' themselves as football as it used to be. Cheap entry, stand where you want, enjoy a pasty/burger/pint with your mates, and chat to players in a friendly environment after the game. All for less than a tenner. The message that 'yes the standard is lower, but the entertainment is still there' could be put out there to many football fans who just want to see a competitive game between 2 teams who play for the love of the game - not neccessarily for any financial reward.

The problem is that many of these clubs are run by volunteers (as dedicated as they are), and this will mean extra duties on already overstretched committees.

[Tom Trust]

I suspect that many Cornish football fans have lost interest in a league that includes teams from over the river. It had much more meaning when they played other Cornish sides. Just my opinion. Can't say I was particularly interested in the new league when it came in.

[DanBlazey]

It has always included teams from England! The SWL was never exclusively Cornish!!

[Tom Trust]

Well, yes, but in the last few years of the SWL there weren't many English clubs, were there. All but three or four home games were against a Cornish rival.

[DanBlazey]

In the end, it wasn't healthy for the development of the game in Cornwall or for clubs with an interest in moving up the football pyramid.

[isaac rosenberg]

One or two have tried, but it ends in tears. Look at Blazey now ! Look at Molinnis Park, come to that! Remember Falmouth from the 70s ! After winning the league five years running, crowds dropped. Too predictable. Even Kevin's wallet is mortal. The old story, an English FA dictating policies suited to the urban elite. Kick'em out, explode the Bridge, follow the example of the People's Republic of St Just !

Rather beat Penzance or Pendeen than Witheridge any day ! :drink:

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

Are you suggesting that we drill along the Tamar and drift gently down to the Caribbean as Kernow Island ? Please remember Isaac that by doing so, the CCFA would still be with us and rescue from a semi-friendly country may be some distance away.

Blazey and Falmouth fans obviously are a fickle bunch and have gone over to St Austell and Penryn, both of whom are now attracting bigger crowds than their illustrious neighbours (and dare I say it, a more attractive brand of football). Newquay fans have returned to Mount Wise having seen that the current set up is one that has a sense of purpose and desire, our away support is still the best in the SWPL despite us being in Div 1 West, Loyal and proud, not fickle or only turn up when we are winning.

NEWQUAY AFC, CORNWALLS NUMBER ONE CLUB !!! (St. Just a close 2nd)

[DanBlazey]

One or two have tried, but it ends in tears. Look at Blazey now ! Look at Molinnis Park, come to that! Remember Falmouth from the 70s ! After winning the league five years running, crowds dropped. Too predictable. Even Kevin's wallet is mortal. The old story, an English FA dictating policies suited to the urban elite. Kick'em out, explode the Bridge, follow the example of the People's Republic of St Just !

Rather beat Penzance or Pendeen than Witheridge any day !

Don't tempt me! Mind you, could make away days at Elburton and Parkway rather tricky!

[turns]

i grew up as blazey through and through,watched great players there,martyn doel wacks pern taylor grainger swiggs kennealy i could go on and on as a kid hang around and helped the builders on the changeing rooms and snooker hall ,crowds were always good (they spent money)

As i got older and started playing there times had changed it went local player wise but as per the so called fans slowly dwindled away. The one thing was you played for the club home or away you went to the club house for a drink or severall, where does that happen now how many players do that, you played for the first team you had to play for the reserves,how many fans still turn up now at blazey compared to the mewton era!!!!!!!! the same happens all over st austell were close to exstinsion look at them now.

the loyalty will happen with fans when they see players sticking around through good and bad, i never played to GRAB money like most out there but i tnink it needs to be cut out, a car of 2 or 3 to penzance from plymouth costs bout 30 pound round trip give the driver the 30 the other 2 10 each,thats 5 for travelling 5 for playing the driver gets his fuel sorted from part the pleyers money thats the only way to get club men, how many grabbers will change there view when they havent got a game cos they priced them selves out

[DanBlazey]

Are you suggesting that we drill along the Tamar and drift gently down to the Caribbean as Kernow Island ? Please remember Isaac that by doing so, the CCFA would still be with us and rescue from a semi-friendly country may be some distance away.

Blazey and Falmouth fans obviously are a fickle bunch and have gone over to St Austell and Penryn, both of whom are now attracting bigger crowds than their illustrious neighbours (and dare I say it, a more attractive brand of football). Newquay fans have returned to Mount Wise having seen that the current set up is one that has a sense of purpose and desire, our away support is still the best in the SWPL despite us being in Div 1 West, Loyal and proud, not fickle or only turn up when we are winning.

NEWQUAY AFC, CORNWALLS NUMBER ONE CLUB !!! (St. Just a close 2nd)

Maybe, but it has been a valuable exercise in seeing which supporters will stay with the club through the hard times as well as the good. We may have dropped significantly, but we still have a loyal hardcore of fans who travel to more or less every home and away game. Not many clubs can say that in this league.

The "fairweather fans" will be welcomed back with open arms when we are back at the top again. It goes with the territory when you follow a succesful club.

[turns]

dan fair play to you for your loyalty but how much do you want those GLORY HUNTERS surely its better to have a consistant fan base putting money into the club to help finance keeping you at a high level by spending time with the players and putting money behind the bar rather than topping things up when the goings good

[chairman]

Dare I attempt to take issue with our friend The Judge when he boasts about the Newquay support? The one off gate v Godolphin which contorts their home average by possibly 80/90 and away shows no great travelling contingent.

Like Falmouth and the likes, St Blazey are suffering partially from the lack of real local Derbies.

[Paul]

Ill add a little extra to this. I think youll find quite a few of our fans watching part games and using the clubhouse bar to full effect on matchdays. Last season we averaged over 100 every game and had an average season. This season has seen St Blazey fall out of a chance to win anything very early on and so interest was bound to go. The away following is as good as ever and a good following will be at Launceston tomorrow. The loyal following will follow through thick and thin.

On a sad note, it must be noted that weve seen so many St Blazey fans die in the last 12 months who would follow the side week in, week out. Im sure theyre watching on for free now!!

We will be back at the top.....watch this space!! :thumbsup:

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing but respect for those who support a club through thick and thin, I should, as I am one of them. Take the G game out and add the 'real' attendances before Xmas and our average is actually over 100. As for our away support, no one compares to us in Div 1 West, again taking the G game out, no one has yet brought more than 10 or so to Mount Wise this season. Something Blazey fans can be proud of is the consistantly good support they take away from home.

How many of the SWPL sides with reserves in the Combo/ECPL will have a good travelling support for the reserves when the fisrt team don't have a game ? We follow Newquay AFC, not just the first team.

There may be something in the local boys for local clubs argument but how many of Mewtons Blazey men were local ? Porthleven have local players, are doing well in the league but still can't attract the fans they used to, whereas PZ crowds are up and have the Mewton factor (perhaps he is the attraction who adds to the gates)

The Newquay Number One Club comment was put in stir interest. The comment about a good afternoon/evening out for a Tenner is a valid one, something I mentioned back in the old SWL days, so contact your local paper and ask them to support your club through a press campaign to get fans back into grounds.

Its Valentines day, double the gate today, drag the other half along, I'm sure she will thank you ! (Mrs Judge is driving again today, a new ground for her, Wendron).

[chairman]

:c: Isn't it a great pity that the League is now so far flung and dis-jointed that there is no room for cosy get-togethers a-la- Bob Bell where such problems could be discussed amongst Chairmen etc and common problems could be aired and maybe even lessons learned.

One gets the same "Ivory Towers"feel about the League set up as we have about that other organisation in White River slum. :smiley20:

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

I'm not sure this is an HQ issue, it is down to individual clubs to get supporters through the gates and into the bar. Perhaps we should take a leaf from the tourist attractions book, no one leaves unless they pass through the souviner shop, so make our exits at grounds lead directly into the clubhouse !

Offer discounts through the local press, get matchday fixture posters put up in local business windows, get topless bar staff if necessary (although a rigourous selection process must be followed), just do something, anything, no matter how small to help yourselves.

[Guest Uncle Albert]

What you will find is that the Devon element of the Pennsula is becoming stronger, at the expense of the Cornish element. And this will increase next season when Bob Bell is replaced by a Devon-based chairman.

The League secretary is based in East Devon and while he works incredibly hard for the organisation, does a good job, and catches trains to many far-flung grounds (far flung from his home anyway), it is only natural that he has closer contact with Devon clubs.

The League press officer is Devon-based, big mates with the East Devon-based league secretary, and close to the likes of Plymouth Parkway. It's only natural he leans towards Devon rather than Cornwall.

Look at the premier division table at the moment - four of the top five are Devon clubs, and Bodmin Town, who are top and should go on to retain the title, are unlikely to be challenging next season when the Carey money is withdrawn and the Plymouth-based and Falmouth-based players find football nearer home.

In such economic hard times, players are going to find it difficult to justify travelling miles and miles to play for teams, especially when the budgets at most clubs this summer will be cut to the bare bones.

Many of the best players in the Peninsula premier are Plymouth-based, and it will make sense for them to play for the likes of Parkway, Tavistock, Ivybridge etc, when times get hard, and when Cornish clubs haven't got the budgets to cover their petrol costs.

So Devon clubs will get stronger, and Cornish clubs will get weaker.

What it really needs is a Cornwall League - but that was always the case. It's just that the credit crunch and the recession have made it so much clearer this season.

[chairman]

Spot on, you've got it sussed brilliantly.The only inducement to go to step 6 was the carrot of more funding, but that's never going to be there for all of us without access to other big monies.

There is no real interest down here in most of the Devon sides and travel costs will increasingly become a deterrent to travel.

We are operating on a downturn in gate receipts and associated incomes against an upturn in all other costs.

[turns]

is that partly because your still paying for the cost of hunting glory in the past chairman

[DanBlazey]

Hahahahahaha. I've been called "poorly informed" in the past, but that's just a stupid, stupid thing to say!!

[turns]

which post you referring to dan

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

Safe to say, it was your posting TURNS.

Clubs budgets are usually set for a season and if Blazey or any other club cut theirs last August, then that is the way of it. Lessons may have been learnt from the past by paying too much (again not just Blazey) and cloth cut accordingly. Just take a look at Truro, the owner has realised that he cannot afford to continue paying stupid silly money and has cut it down to just silly money. Other clubs will take a long hard look at the books come next August and budgets will be cut all over the place.

Continuing to pay unrealistic amounts for 'expenses' will be for those who are power mad or just plain stupid, the rest of us will pay what can be afforded in an effort to balance the books.

Paying money at Blazey in the past bought them a lot of success, they enjoyed it whilst it lasted, some of us are still waiting for our turn but not by breaking the bank in order to do it.

Carry on Chairman !

[turns]

judge i agree with you on the fact budgets get cut when times are hard but why pay silly money in the first place? Numerous clubs have done and will continue to do but for what gain when a prize money at the end of season doesnt even cover a 3rd of most clubs overall budget,why highlight it so much now surely a limit per week should be imposed by the league

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

I don't think Blazey are suffering now due to paying too much in the past in answer to the point your raised previously. They could afford to do so then and now they can't, thwy have cut their cloth accordingly and rightly so.

I agree that clubs should been sensible with the money thay have but for some historic reason, players have had 'expenses' paid to them which in the last 20 years or so have become unrealistic at this level of football. The times, they are a changing, players will have to get used to less cash and may return to playing for their local sides for little or no money at all. No need for the CCFA to get involved, the financial climate will always dictate who plays for who and those who have a sugar daddy willing to splash out will always be top dogs.

Bodmin were skint and were the worst side at Priory Park for a decade, finished bottom of the SWL, the following season, a money man turned up and they won the league... Perranporth are another side who are trying to buy success but when the money runs out, so will the players. Bills have to be paid and if someone is willing to cover your mortgage or rent each month, you too would be tempted.

The sensible approach is to nuture the young, instill a sense of loyalty to the club and let them play football with those they grew up with.

[turns]

judge i for 1 never played for money despite some very good and rewarding offers if taken, i played for the banter on a saturday ,you cant beat that but what or how does a club benefit by paying players no matter how big or small there budget is in the long term, 1 season good 5 bad 1 good as a club member why should you bankroll others for no loyalty (in no means am i regarding you as a member of newquay or any other club)

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

I agree with you Turns, in a perfect world, well SWPL/COMBO/ECPL anyway, there would be no payments to players. But and it is a big but, someone will always come along and slip a few quid in a players boots after the match as happened back in the 50's when football locally was supposedly amatuer. You can ban payments but the ego-mentalists will always find ways around the rules so that their club will have the best players willing to prostitute themselves.

Your comment still rankles, Blazey are not suffering now because they paid whatever they could afford when Mewton was in charge, they are being sensible and fair play to them.

[D K]

No need for the CCFA to get involved

No need or no point?

The best thing CCFA could do is get rid of any pointless staff and divide their salaries between the clubs.

There's at least another £150k per annum back into Grass roots football, sod certain "development" individuals who spend more time on jollies.

I speak in jest of course as i'm sure those in power wont be hit by any recession issues.

Devon League, Top 4 Playoff, 2 go forward to Regional play off draw.

Cornwall League, Top 4 playoff, 2 go forward to Regional play off draw.

Repeat the process until a winner is found who then has to move to the next stage of the pyramid.

This will help all fans with travel and add another potential big day out for playoffs.

Season stays alive longer for lots of clubs who will soon be suffering from "dead rubber" football otherwise.

I'm sure St Blazey would rather have nothing at stake (other than pride) in a Restormel derby rather than travelling to Clyst or Witheridge wishing the season over!

[Paul]

Im glad to see the Judge sticking up for St Blazey!! Good to see. As he has said, its not like the club has gone to pot, the facts are we are in a so called credit crunch were bills still have to be paid. Many big companys cannot make ends meet so you have to say its a good call to cut any player budget.

The sucess has been mentioned here to, but it runs deeper than a few cup wins. Look at Blaize Park. Over the past 10 years, the ground have had a new stand built, tided up the stand behind the goal, covered entrance or players to safely leave the pitch, painted parts of the ground, new gates to the club, and of course, made the ground fully enclosed. Recently money has been spent inside the clubhouse. Its not all about putting 11 players together for a saturday.

Dont get me wrong, watching St Blazey win so much over a length of time was just fantastic, but im still enjoying following St Blazey as much now. Cullumpton away on saturday....bring em on. :drink:

[DanBlazey]

You're sounding bizarrely positive after our performance today! Gotta say, I'm looking forward to the Cullompton trip too!

[Argyle Fan]

I find myself in the unusual position of agreeing with Mr Judge - it really is up to clubs to get off their a*se and help themselves.

A number of clubs do sportsmans evenings, bingo nights, race nights etc etc.

I've been watching SWL / Devon League / SWPL football for about 20 years now & there has always been a kind of jealousy aimed at St Blazey as if everything had just dropped in their laps. As outlined earlier in this thread there has been an enormous amount of work involved.

Similarly at Buckland, they have worked incredibly hard over the past few years to create a facility which is arguably the best in the SWPL.

Uncle Arthur - I didn't realise that the election of the new league chairman had been held already? Surely this will happen at the AGM?

Has anyone in Cornwall put themselves forward as an alternative candidate to the current vice-chairman?

Is it a case of people getting off their ar*e again?

I think it would be sensible to at least give clubs an option otherwise the Devon bias question will no doubt be raised again.

It's a bit unfair to criticise the league secretary for having the misfortune to live in Exeter. I believe he has already seen every single SWPL team play this season and has visited the majority of the grounds, planning to visit the rest before the end of the season.

As far as the press officer is concerned, presumably if he was to move about half a mile to Saltash he would then become cornwall-biased?

[Guest Peppermint]

Just picking up on two postings - firstly Mark Hayman is currently the Vice Chairman of the CSWPL and in my opinion is doing a good job so it is logical and sensible that he takes over at the AGM if Bob Bell is standing down. I think most clubs would agree that would be a sensible solution and the Cornwall/ Devon issue is irrelevant.

Secondly - a comment on Tom Trust's surprising comments regarding him not being particularly interested in the new league because it contained too many teams from 'England' as he so quantily puts it! If that is the case why is then so interested in watching Truro City so much because they play teams from 'England' every match. Before anyone from City accuses me of anti Truro postings this was not a dig at Truro - just an observation on Mr Trust's surprising comment regarding the new CSWPL.

[Argyle Fan]

Peppermint - I agree Mark Hayman is doing an excellent job but is it wise to elect him un-opposed?

You say that the Devon / Cornwall issue is irrelevant, but many of your fellow cornishmen are not as enlightened as you are.

I believe the treasurer (cornish-based) may also be standing down. Will his replacement also be devon-based?

[DanBlazey]

Just picking up on two postings - firstly Mark Hayman is currently the Vice Chairman of the CSWPL and in my opinion is doing a good job so it is logical and sensible that he takes over at the AGM if Bob Bell is standing down. I think most clubs would agree that would be a sensible solution and the Cornwall/ Devon issue is irrelevant.

Secondly - a comment on Tom Trust's surprising comments regarding him not being particularly interested in the new league because it contained too many teams from 'England' as he so quantily puts it! If that is the case why is then so interested in watching Truro City so much because they play teams from 'England' every match. Before anyone from City accuses me of anti Truro postings this was not a dig at Truro - just an observation on Mr Trust's surprising comment regarding the new CSWPL.

No need for the quotation marks around "England", Peppermint. Whilst the exact status of Cornwall has never been properly resolved, the majority of Cornish men and women I meet still call themselves "Cornish not English" and believe Cornwall to be a land (safest word I can find!) separate from England. I include myself in this category and therefore for me the SWPL Premier includes teams from Both England and Cornwall.

[Argyle Fan]

Proves my point I think.

DanBlazey, how would you view an english chairman & an english treasurer as well as the english secretary?

Before you all jump down my throat I'm trying to understand why so many of you moan about the so called devon bias in the SWPL but are then happy for someone from devon to get the top job un-opposed.

[DanBlazey]

Wouldn't bother me at all mate - I would want the best man for the job, be they Cornish, English or whatever.

What I do object to are flags with the cross of St George being hung at Blaise Park - but that's maybe for another thread and another day...

[Guest Man on the Post]

I don't understand the Cornwall / England thing, but I often think that a few of the posters on this forum are from another planet! :thumbsup:

[Guest The Judge aka RED OR DEAD]

What I do object to are flags with the cross of St George being hung at Blaise Park - but that's maybe for another thread and another day...

You're not getting away with that comment Dan, take a look at Pauls piccy on his forum ID and you will see the White Ensign with St Blazey across the middle (admittedly it is a poor effort), surely an English emblem of HM Navy does not count as Cornish. If the anti English stance were to spread amongst all Cornishmen, Argyle would have a home gate of around 4,000.

The amount of good Cornish folk who support England in Football, Cricket and Rugby clearly shows that you are a minority on this subject. I am fortunate enough to live in the wonderful County/Country/Land of Kernow and find that the vast majority of the host nation are a welcoming bunch, including those at Blaise Park.

[DanBlazey]

Humble pie time for me. I guess the best way for me to put it is that if I had any Blazey flags, I would not choose the English flag for them. I understand that many of our supporters come from over the border and wish to express their English identity as well as love for their football team.

I'm not anti-England, not really anti-anyone (except for you sometimes, Judge, and maybe TCFC). I just don't believe Cornwall to be part of England and think it's important we maintain our unique identity.

[hedgerow]

But you are happy to hang your banners at Clubs you travel too in Devon.

[Andy Yeatman]

In terms of struggling for crowds there is no Devon-Cornwall bias. Went to watch Wadebridge at Dartmouth yesterday and, don't know what the official attendance was, but with a quick count I reckon there were more on the pitch and in the dugouts, than paying spectators!

[NORTH DEVON DWELLER]

What I do object to are flags with the cross of St George being hung at Blaise Park - but that's maybe for another thread and another day... quote DANBLAZEY

How can you object Dan. If my memory serves me right when St Blazey visited us last season didn't you lot plaster our fences with cornish flags????

On another note i never thought the day would come when i would say this but i have to agree with the JUDGE clubs need to help themselves when it comes to trying to raise gates and revenue.

Final note on the topic name as many teams in the SWPL premier know Witheridge at 99% of away games bring a minibus full of supporters unfortunatelly the decision was taken by myself as the bus driver that on the day of the Blazey game the weather conditions up here were to bad to travel.

[Mike Odgers]

NDD,

Have a safe journey to Bickland on Saturday for your longest trip.

I will look out for you and make myself known.