Another referee lost

[cornish leg end]

Not very good to read at all. Why would a player lock him in the changing room? And players wonder why we are so short of referees now! 
 

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/fa-investigates-after-cornwall-referee-7793555?fbclid=IwAR39qPKnaF_LYuOI6tuqRpoRbXiF0sInEZGpkmgt0Y6k8YTsSEPEawMGbUU#la783ddmuulyecmcpt

[BoratSagdiyev]

When will players realise they are literally killing their own game?

 

[BrummyBarry]

any ref on here willing to back up the claim that theyre unsupported? I think Borat has summed it up perfectly that they're literally killing their own game but are first to moan when the manager or parent have to refere because there's noone else available 

[Roche Raider]

As per usual, total thugs and reprobates think this is an acceptable way to behave. Toxic thuggery is destroying this game and too many want to sweep it under the rug. Thick numbskulls who talk with their fists rather than their heads. 

 

 the lot of em! Both Bude Town and Lanreath need the book thrown at them for allowing this to unfold. Pathetic.

[cornish leg end]

Fa need to get involved and make a statement punishment here remove the club from the league! 

[Seasider 11]

2 hours ago, Roche Raider said:

As per usual, total thugs and reprobates think this is an acceptable way to behave. Toxic thuggery is destroying this game and too many want to sweep it under the rug. Thick numbskulls who talk with their fists rather than their heads. 

 

 the lot of em! Both Bude Town and Lanreath need the book thrown at them for allowing this to unfold. Pathetic.

This had absolutely nothing to do with Bude Town so not sure why you would say that we would need to have the book thrown at us?

[BoratSagdiyev]

1 hour ago, BrummyBarry said:

any ref on here willing to back up the claim that theyre unsupported? I think Borat has summed it up perfectly that they're literally killing their own game but are first to moan when the manager or parent have to refere because there's noone else available 

The support available from the CFA is very good. But retrospective support doesn't make the experience for refs any better on the day. Even handing out fines / punishments doesn't stop it and the same clubs / people offend.  

Football needs mandatory proactive education around this. For example, there is no modules around laws of the game or referee communication in any FA coaching badges.

Until grassroots football creates an environment where referees feel safe and enjoy their participation the rot will continue. This is on the clubs, players and spectators to fix. 

 

[BrummyBarry]

How can it be improved though practically. What would you introduce if you were running the show?

[BryJayLew]

1 hour ago, BoratSagdiyev said:

The support available from the CFA is very good. But retrospective support doesn't make the experience for refs any better on the day. Even handing out fines / punishments doesn't stop it and the same clubs / people offend.  

Football needs mandatory proactive education around this. For example, there is no modules around laws of the game or referee communication in any FA coaching badges.

Until grassroots football creates an environment where referees feel safe and enjoy their participation the rot will continue. This is on the clubs, players and spectators to fix. 

 

Totally agree with this statement! The buck stops with the football clubs around the county, they should not be allowing players who represent their club to drag their identity into the sewer!! There is more to "winning" football matches than scoring more goals than the opposition on a Saturday afternoon.

[BrummyBarry]

I find it more concerning that this referee is throwing cornwall fa under the bus by saying there's no support. If this happened on Saturday (Cornwall FA office closed at weekends im.led to believe) and hes gone to the papers on a Monday has he even given the fa time to offer him support? I dont know much about reffing in Cornwall apart from the few Ive met and talk to when I want some.gossip but they say the support network in Cornwall for refs is actually really good so I'm struggling to see why this chap has gone to the papers. Regardless though I have been to watch a few games recently where there's been a spectator or manager as referee. What hope do they have. I went and watched praze not long ago against porthleven whefe the ref was part of praise he took alot of stick during the game and then I saw he also got a lot of hassle on social media after the game too so it makes me wonder if this issue is affecting all those without a qualified referee and if it's about time they point blank refused to do the games 

[Dave Deacon]

16 minutes ago, BrummyBarry said:

(Cornwall FA office closed at weekends im.led to believe)

If this is correct, should there be someone at the Cornwall FA on standby each weekend?

2 hours ago, Roche Raider said:

Both Bude Town and Lanreath need the book thrown at them for allowing this to unfold.

Why Bude?

[BrummyBarry]

3 minutes ago, Dave Deacon said:

If this is correct, should there be someone at the Cornwall FA on standby each weekend?

Why Bude?

That would be a question for them but as far as I'm aware by looking quickly at their website, there is a member of staff active at weekends for safeguarding issues and from what I've just been told when messaging  on face book is that the referee department are always available especially at the weekend. I just cant see that there was no support for this chap 

[bighairydave]

8 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

If this is correct, should there be someone at the Cornwall FA on standby each weekend?

There is!

[soccer fan]

Why Bude? 

Because it is the responsibility of the home club to look after the referee,fans and the event (match). I know it maybe not there players but im pretty sure the home club is responsible for everything at the game even if its the away fans and players causing trouble and there responsibility to gid rid if these people or things from the game for safety reasons.

 

With the away team in this instant lanreath they have to be identified by the referee,club or even cctv to have santations against them. 

So if you are the home team make sure you have everything in place from when the referee arrives, in the club house and when the referee leaves the ground. So as home club i would have one person desinated to look after the match officails. 

[Ian Pethick]

12 hours ago, BoratSagdiyev said:

When will players realise they are literally killing their own game?

 

Perhaps referees should start to think about taking collective action here. Some sort of withdrawal of labour, a selected Saturday when there are no officials available for example (effectively going on strike). Might focus a few minds.

[Roche Raider]

9 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

If this is correct, should there be someone at the Cornwall FA on standby each weekend?

Why Bude?

Come on Dave, when you're a football club you're more than just results and trying to win. You invite visitors, spectators and officials to your premises with the pretense of protection and safety being of utmost priority. 

Doesnt matter who was wearing which club colours, you safeguard to the best of your ability. 

[mbkted]

Having reffed a game as a volunteer and had the abuse first hand, sometimes from my own team, I have absolutely no idea why anyone would want to give up their time to ref on a weekend for the small amount of money they receive.

i certainly won’t be doing it again

[Ian Pethick]

57 minutes ago, mbkted said:

Having reffed a game as a volunteer and had the abuse first hand, sometimes from my own team, I have absolutely no idea why anyone would want to give up their time to ref on a weekend for the small amount of money they receive.

i certainly won’t be doing it again

I would love to see the two players that were sent off given the option of doing a referee course (in return for having any forthcoming suspensions rescinded), and then officiating at a match themselves. 

[Foul Throw 3]

Been told one of the red cards was the result of one sin bin and one yellow card. So the sin bin yellow card added to the "normal" yellow resulted in the red. So the official has got the ruling completely wrong. If he's been a referee for 3 years as he said in his report, he should know this rule quite well? If this is indeed true, I'd hope this is covered in the match reports by the official and both clubs.

However, I do not condone any of the alleged treatment received as it's intimidating/threatening and can understand the feeling of not wanting to do it again. I've tried it and it's the toughest job in football. If referees are poor or sub-standard, help them improve with good comms or doing it correctly in your match reports to help them improve. And if you have a poor ref, it's likely justified by your own playing level. 

[Richard Chown]

13 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

If this is correct, should there be someone at the Cornwall FA on standby each weekend?

Last season I was involved in a fixture that was oddly abandoned. No violence, no abuse to the match official but I just needed clarification as a club official on how to proceed.  I was able to call a CCFA representative who was on call to give me advice and also a Trelawny league representative who gave me advice and the situation was resolved. 

Speaking as someone who has also officiated games, in this incident you would write up your match report which is reviewed by the CCFA. Clubs will be contacted on the incident in writing.  The CCFA is there to give full support to match officials. 

Just for balance I've also been on the other side of the coin and had to face a disciplinary panel at the CCFA. There is due process in all these incidents. 

 

[Dave Deacon]

The referee in question comments in the article : "I have actually said to the FA that I don't want to ref anymore. I'm not interested in refereeing now because of this. I reckon I've probably refereed over 50 games."

50 games in 3 seasons isn’t very many is it?

[Foul Throw 3]

Only one completed season in that time period though Deacs?

[Dave Deacon]

18 minutes ago, Foul Throw 3 said:

Only one completed season in that time period though Deacs?

Ah yes forgetting covid times! 👍

[Richard R]

Why would Lanreath have the key to the ref's changing room at Bude Town?

[BoratSagdiyev]

1 minute ago, Richard R said:

Why would Lanreath have the key to the ref's changing room at Bude Town?

Was probably still in the door 🚪

[karaoke]

Lesson one is 'never leave the key in the outside lock'

[Cornishreferee]

7 hours ago, Foul Throw 3 said:

Been told one of the red cards was the result of one sin bin and one yellow card. So the sin bin yellow card added to the "normal" yellow resulted in the red. So the official has got the ruling completely wrong. If he's been a referee for 3 years as he said in his report, he should know this rule quite well? If this is indeed true, I'd hope this is covered in the match reports by the official and both clubs.

However, I do not condone any of the alleged treatment received as it's intimidating/threatening and can understand the feeling of not wanting to do it again. I've tried it and it's the toughest job in football. If referees are poor or sub-standard, help them improve with good comms or doing it correctly in your match reports to help them improve. And if you have a poor ref, it's likely justified by your own playing level. 

But do you know which offence came first the sin bin or the yellow?

[Foul Throw 3]

4 minutes ago, Cornishreferee said:

But do you know which offence came first the sin bin or the yellow?

Sin bin first. Foul second. 

[BoratSagdiyev]

6 hours ago, karaoke said:

Lesson one is 'never leave the key in the outside lock'

Really? Surely lesson one should be "don't be an to referees"

Are you saying a referee should expect this sort of behaviour from players? 

[BoratSagdiyev]

29 minutes ago, Foul Throw 3 said:

Sin bin first. Foul second. 

Why does it matter? Its wrong either way. However if you commit 2 cautionable offences you can't complain too much if you end up off the field. Give a ref a decision to make, he might not always make the right one.... its easier to not let them have a chance to make a mistake.

There are 8 permutations of sin bin related outcomes. For a referee at duchy league to not quite get that right can obviously happen, espeically if they've only done 50 games.

The correct way for Lanreath to deal with it would have been to log it in their match report and follow up with a call the the CFA. The red card would have been overturned and coaching and development given to the referee as necessary. 

Instead, we have an individual that's embarrassed themselves, affected the reputation of their club and intimidated a referee that no longer wants to do it. Fines and bans will probably occur too. Why are these people so stupid? What were they hoping for in their actions? It's baffling. 

[Cornishreferee]

8 minutes ago, BoratSagdiyev said:

Why does it matter? Its wrong either way. However if you commit 2 cautionable offences you can't complain too much if you end up off the field. Give a ref a decision to make, he might not always make the right one.... its easier to not let them have a chance to make a mistake.

There are 8 permutations of sin bin related outcomes. For a referee at duchy league to not quite get that right can obviously happen, espeically if they've only done 50 games.

The correct way for Lanreath to deal with it would have been to log it in their match report and follow up with a call the the CFA. The red card would have been overturned and coaching and development given to the referee as necessary. 

Instead, we have an individual that's embarrassed themselves, affected the reputation of their club and intimidated a referee that no longer wants to do it. Fines and bans will probably occur too. Why are these people so stupid? What were they hoping for in their actions? It's baffling. 

The only reason I asked is for the fact that when you are in the sun bin so from the moment you are shown the car and told to take take mins anything between the car and the 10 mins being up is a straight red card, so if he had been sent to the bin and said something or wouldn’t sit down it would have resulted in a red card

[BryJayLew]

9 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

Ah yes forgetting covid times! 👍

Also don't forget that being an assistant at Peninsula level would take up a lot of other Saturday afternoons.......3 officials needed at these games! So 50 soon becomes a lot more games being involved in??!! 

5 hours ago, karaoke said:

Lesson one is 'never leave the key in the outside lock'

If you know the set up at Bude......they have a bolt on the outside of the Referees changing room.........why wasnt this picked up before???

[bighairydave]

3 hours ago, Cornishreferee said:

The only reason I asked is for the fact that when you are in the sun bin so from the moment you are shown the car and told to take take mins anything between the car and the 10 mins being up is a straight red card, so if he had been sent to the bin and said something or wouldn’t sit down it would have resulted in a red card

Not a red card but isn’t allowed to come back on and also can’t be substituted at the end of ten minutes.

The player I believe was sin binned then gave the referee further dissent and was given another yellow card. Shouldn’t have been a red but rightly not allowed to come back on.

5 hours ago, karaoke said:

Lesson one is 'never leave the key in the outside lock'

Who is saying it was a key? Apparently a padlock and a bolt apparently, and reports today when speaking with another official from North Cornwall apparently something similar happened to the officials changing room in the SWPL the week before as well!

[stevieb]

On 08/11/2022 at 13:01, Dave Deacon said:

The referee in question comments in the article : "I have actually said to the FA that I don't want to ref anymore. I'm not interested in refereeing now because of this. I reckon I've probably refereed over 50 games."

50 games in 3 seasons isn’t very many is it?

Doesn't matter if 1st game or 5000 games , pathetic  they need to grow up . How , why are we going to attract officials if they feel intimidated or threatened on or off the pitch  ?  No refs , officials no game that's it in a nutshell,   perhaps some could go to a refs meeting and see what they do off the pitch , I was invited to one and it was an eye opener,  and informative as well , perhaps Yourself could go to one and use your podcast to help players clubs appreciate what goes into being a ref . It's not all getting a match fee . I have had the pleasure of sharing a changing room with various refs and opposition club linos and they all want the same as players a good  game of football. 

 

[Dave Deacon]

6 hours ago, stevieb said:

Doesn't matter if 1st game or 5000 games , pathetic  they need to grow up . How , why are we going to attract officials if they feel intimidated or threatened on or off the pitch  ?  No refs , officials no game that's it in a nutshell,   perhaps some could go to a refs meeting and see what they do off the pitch , I was invited to one and it was an eye opener,  and informative as well , perhaps Yourself could go to one and use your podcast to help players clubs appreciate what goes into being a ref . It's not all getting a match fee . I have had the pleasure of sharing a changing room with various refs and opposition club linos and they all want the same as players a good  game of football. 

Wow! All I said was 50 games in 3 seasons isn’t very many is it?

Actually what would be a better idea is for players to be formally invited to pop along to a refs meeting. That's half the battle these days as it seems it's a refs v players situation whereas it used to be that the refs would have a good dialogue during the match with the players and everyone would be working for the same outcome.

[bighairydave]

1 hour ago, Dave Deacon said:

Wow! All I said was 50 games in 3 seasons isn’t very many is it?

Actually what would be a better idea is for players to be formally invited to pop along to a refs meeting. That's half the battle these days as it seems it's a refs v players situation whereas it used to be that the refs would have a good dialogue during the match with the players and everyone would be working for the same outcome.

Has happened in the past, with a massive 0 attending!

[Dave Deacon]

27 minutes ago, bighairydave said:

Has happened in the past, with a massive 0 attending!

I thought as much! Perhaps the clubs should take the initiative and invite refs to their training sessions?

[Devils@Dusk]

On 08/11/2022 at 09:17, mbkted said:

Having reffed a game as a volunteer and had the abuse first hand, sometimes from my own team, I have absolutely no idea why anyone would want to give up their time to ref on a weekend for the small amount of money they receive.

i certainly won’t be doing it again

Years ago, my father was in a similar situation. He felt the same way as you did/do.

 

On 08/11/2022 at 08:48, Way Of The Park said:

Perhaps referees should start to think about taking collective action here. Some sort of withdrawal of labour, a selected Saturday when there are no officials available for example (effectively going on strike). Might focus a few minds.

My father has said exactly the same thing. He also suggested that referees should leave the pitch and refuse to let the game to continue unless players/teams "get their act together".  

[fenman]

I don't know why your'e all getting het up .There will never be a shortage of referees . Every game has at least 22 referees and in the premiership there are at least 24 plus 40 odd thousand in the stands .

On a serious note I watched the Newcastle /  Chelsea game  , a classic example of how low the professional game has sunk ,  blatant time wasting to a fine art  unruly behavior at the end  . The financial rewards have ruined the game . I enjoyed it more when top players earnt about twice the wages a bricklayer got .

Respect campaign has been running for a few years but what has it achieved ? 

[Dave Deacon]

13 hours ago, fenman said:

unruly behavior at the end 

Absolutely abhorrent at the end. I’ll never know how more red cards aren’t shown!

[St Darren]

20 hours ago, fenman said:

I don't know why your'e all getting het up .There will never be a shortage of referees . Every game has at least 22 referees and in the premiership there are at least 24 plus 40 odd thousand in the stands .

On a serious note I watched the Newcastle /  Chelsea game  , a classic example of how low the professional game has sunk ,  blatant time wasting to a fine art  unruly behavior at the end  . The financial rewards have ruined the game . I enjoyed it more when top players earnt about twice the wages a bricklayer got .

Respect campaign has been running for a few years but what has it achieved ? 

Is this somethibg that the referee could have done something about? 

Time wasting can happen at any stage in the game so book players for doing it! 

They should also create a law that if a player goes down that causes the game to stop then they should go off regardless of whether a physio comes on. 

Supporters are paying a handsome sum of money to watch 90 mins of football but they are only getting about 55 mins most weeks! 

[fenman]

I know we all have opinions  on matters in life and often wonder why other people can have such a , sometimes biased view opposite to your own . BUT I can't see for the life of me why the rule makers can't see the blatant pointless  substitutions in order to waste time in the 85th or so minutes . Rather than clamping down on it they've made matters worse by introducing extra subs . Are they too weak to stamp out the constant arguing and surrounding the referee , the managers are even at it now . Totally agree with you Darren the paying public are being robbed .

[St Darren]

1 hour ago, fenman said:

I know we all have opinions  on matters in life and often wonder why other people can have such a , sometimes biased view opposite to your own . BUT I can't see for the life of me why the rule makers can't see the blatant pointless  substitutions in order to waste time in the 85th or so minutes . Rather than clamping down on it they've made matters worse by introducing extra subs . Are they too weak to stamp out the constant arguing and surrounding the referee , the managers are even at it now . Totally agree with you Darren the paying public are being robbed .

No subs in injury time! 

There are so many simple things that the authorities can do to stop it but they don't. 

[stevieb]

On 12/11/2022 at 20:01, Dave Deacon said:

Wow! All I said was 50 games in 3 seasons isn’t very many is it?

Actually what would be a better idea is for players to be formally invited to pop along to a refs meeting. That's half the battle these days as it seems it's a refs v players situation whereas it used to be that the refs would have a good dialogue during the match with the players and everyone would be working for the same outcome.

Dave pathetic was reference to the idiots that locked the ref in the room , 😯