RESULTS - Saturday 22 October 2022

[Dave Deacon]

WESTERN LEAGUE

PREMIER DIVISION

Cadbury Heath                 1-2             Buckland Athletic

Clevedon Town                 6-0             Millbrook

Shepton Mallet                 0-2              Bridgwater United

Welton Rovers                  1-3             Saltash United

(Note : click here for some Cornish clubs involved in FA Vase today)

[sportsman10]

Mike landricombe in the Saltash line up. Very Good signing if Shane managed to talk him into signing full time 

[Philheybrookbay]

Well that was a fantastic first half at Welton, and to be fair we could have been 6 or 7 up at half time. In the first 10 mins we hit the bar twice, had an Adam Carter disallowed goal and with H getting 2 and Callum Merrin getting 1 it was all done and dusted by half time. Welton had a golden chance which hit the underside of cross bar and bounced lord knows how and it could have been half time of 6-2 - it was that direct. 
 

2nd we shut up shop until the last min when Welton scored (ahem so offside he was nearly in Radstock) but it didn’t matter. 3 points. 
 

Cracking welcome from Welton to all fans, players and supporters. Really friendly club - know their limits and aim is to survive this season. They’ve enough about them to do that. Looking forward to seeing them again in a few weeks. 
 

Excellent referee in Ella Broad. Only 1 yellow and allowed free flowing football to be played. Very little backchat from both sides. Just a shame for her, she had to get changed in the closed skittle alley! 

[FootballChat]

20 hours ago, Philheybrookbay said:

Excellent referee in Ella Broad.

Just a shame for her, she had to get changed in the closed skittle alley! 

Based on the few games I’ve watched that she’s been involved in I can say that she is a superb young referee destined for the upper echelons of both the mens and womens game. 

 

It is utterly ridiculous that clubs at step 6 and above still don’t have adequate changing facilities to cater to female officials in this day and age.

 

To expect a referee to get changed in a store room or similar because they have the audacity to be female is a joke.

[Footy follower]

33 minutes ago, FootballChat said:

Based on the few games I’ve watched that she’s been involved in I can say that she is a superb young referee destined for the upper echelons of both the mens and womens game. 

 

It is utterly ridiculous that clubs at step 6 and above still don’t have adequate changing facilities to cater to female officials in this day and age.

 

To expect a referee to get changed in a store room or similar because they have the audacity to be female is a joke.

Why cdnt they have just changed 1 at a time? 

Do you really expect every club at grass roots level to have another spare changing room ready for the odd lady ref? 

Hopefully.. More female refs will come into the men's game and clubs can make the necessary changes but to expect them to have them at present is a bit far fetched.... Bit more shame on the 2 male refs who let her change elsewhere if anything 

[FootballChat]

2 hours ago, Footy follower said:

Do you really expect every club at grass roots level to have another spare changing room ready for the odd lady ref? 

Step 6 and upwards I said, I don’t expect the Dog and Duck Inn to be providing separate changing facilities.

At step 6, these are semi professional football clubs. Having 2 changing rooms shouldn’t be an issue.

2 hours ago, Footy follower said:

Hopefully.. More female refs will come into the men's game 

Why would they, what’s appealing about being shoved in a broom cupboard to get changed?

[Footy follower]

Step 6 is no longer that high a level.... Some clubs struggle for money.. Some have been pushed up from lower feeder leagues......... I think your living in another world. 

Having said that.. Yes it would be great if there were separate changing rooms.... But cmon be practical 

[rocky170267]

Next they will need a third toilet for the gender neutrals!! Worlds gone mad

[FootballChat]

1 hour ago, Footy follower said:

But cmon be practical 

How practical is it for a female officials to have to stand outside sheepishly both before and after the game while her male colleagues get changed? 
It’s 2022, it’s not difficult to provide a room that isn’t full of kit, and has some basic facilities.

Even if the room is used for other things most weeks, clubs get enough notice of their officials to clear it out and make it something other than a store cupboard before the game.

You’ll be moaning about having to provide a separate toilet for females next!

1 hour ago, rocky170267 said:

Worlds gone mad

On what planet is it “mad” to expect desperate changing facilities for women?

What era are you stuck in?

[Dave Deacon]

1 hour ago, FootballChat said:

On what planet is it “mad” to expect desperate changing facilities for women?

I don't think it's that clubs are living in the past, it's simply a matter of sometimes buildings are already too small with the increased squad sizes and so space is at a premium and so it's not only a matter of adding on another room with plumbing etc, and then of course as important it's the cost! 

[silly billy]

8 hours ago, FootballChat said:

How practical is it for a female officials to have to stand outside sheepishly both before and after the game while her male colleagues get changed? 
It’s 2022, it’s not difficult to provide a room that isn’t full of kit, and has some basic facilities.

Even if the room is used for other things most weeks, clubs get enough notice of their officials to clear it out and make it something other than a store cupboard before the game.

You’ll be moaning about having to provide a separate toilet for females next!

On what planet is it “mad” to expect desperate changing facilities for women?

What era are you stuck in?

The polite thing to do would be to let the lady get changed first. Problem solved.

[Soccer Follower]

56 minutes ago, silly billy said:

The polite thing to do would be to let the lady get changed first. Problem solved.

A sensible comment Silly Billy.

[Footy follower]

11 hours ago, FootballChat said:

How practical is it for a female officials to have to stand outside sheepishly both before and after the game while her male colleagues get changed? 
It’s 2022, it’s not difficult to provide a room that isn’t full of kit, and has some basic facilities.

Even if the room is used for other things most weeks, clubs get enough notice of their officials to clear it out and make it something other than a store cupboard before the game.

You’ll be moaning about having to provide a separate toilet for females next!

On what planet is it “mad” to expect desperate changing facilities for women?

What era are you stuck in?

Nobody wants them to have "desperate" changing rooms 😏

[mattelot]

7 hours ago, silly billy said:

The polite thing to do would be to let the lady get changed first. Problem solved.

Well said billy .maybe your not so silly after all .🤔

[FootballChat]

10 hours ago, silly billy said:

The polite thing to do would be to let the lady get changed first. Problem solved.

Problem solved? 
What does the female official do once changed?

Wait sheepishly outside while her colleagues get changed. 🤷🏻

[mattelot]

44 minutes ago, FootballChat said:

Problem solved? 
What does the female official do once changed?

Wait sheepishly outside while her colleagues get changed. 🤷🏻

Meaning of sheepishly !

Waiting in an embarrassed state due to shame or lack of self confidence.🤔

I Dont know the lady in question ,but i would have thought she would be proud not shamed to be doing the job .And certainly not lacking in self confidence . 

Good on her .👍

[silly billy]

2 hours ago, FootballChat said:

Problem solved? 
What does the female official do once changed?

Wait sheepishly outside while her colleagues get changed. 🤷🏻

Use your loaf 🙄

[FootballChat]

Genuinely baffles me that there’s such resistance and ridicule to the idea that a female official shouldn’t have to stand outside while male colleagues change and shower. Bonkers.

[rocky170267]

22 hours ago, FootballChat said:

How practical is it for a female officials to have to stand outside sheepishly both before and after the game while her male colleagues get changed? 
It’s 2022, it’s not difficult to provide a room that isn’t full of kit, and has some basic facilities.

Even if the room is used for other things most weeks, clubs get enough notice of their officials to clear it out and make it something other than a store cupboard before the game.

You’ll be moaning about having to provide a separate toilet for females next!

On what planet is it “mad” to expect desperate changing facilities for women?

What era are you stuck in?

Suggest you read my comment again ??

[mattelot]

3 minutes ago, FootballChat said:

Genuinely baffles me that there’s such resistance and ridicule to the idea that a female official shouldn’t have to stand outside while male colleagues change and shower. Bonkers.

What would happen in women's games.If 2 of the officials were women and 1 was a man ?

 

[silly billy]

22 minutes ago, FootballChat said:

Genuinely baffles me that there’s such resistance and ridicule to the idea that a female official shouldn’t have to stand outside while male colleagues change and shower. Bonkers.

Who says they got to stand outside?

[Footy follower]

2 hours ago, FootballChat said:

Genuinely baffles me that there’s such resistance and ridicule to the idea that a female official shouldn’t have to stand outside while male colleagues change and shower. Bonkers.

Why is she standing outside? 

[FootballChat]

5 hours ago, Footy follower said:

Why is she standing outside? 

Outside the changing room. 🙄

7 hours ago, mattelot said:

What would happen in women's games.If 2 of the officials were women and 1 was a man ?

 

It’s still likely be played in a ground that doesn’t provide adequate facilities and the same issues would arise.

 

Clearly you all don’t think a female referee is worthy of a private space to get changed so my final comment will this:

It should be a ground grading criteria to have male and female facilities. They’re basics in western society.

It’s an FA requirement that women and U18 match officials change separately.

[mattelot]

3 hours ago, FootballChat said:

Outside the changing room. 🙄

It’s still likely be played in a ground that doesn’t provide adequate facilities and the same issues would arise.

 

Clearly you all don’t think a female referee is worthy of a private space to get changed so my final comment will this:

It should be a ground grading criteria to have male and female facilities. They’re basics in western society.

It’s an FA requirement that women and U18 match officials change separately.

Don't take offence ,but may I ask what gender you are ?

[FootballChat]

8 hours ago, mattelot said:

Don't take offence ,but may I ask what gender you are ?

Male. I have worked with several female match officials who are offended, saddened but also not surprised by the lack of accommodation for female officials through football.

[Footy follower]

1 hour ago, FootballChat said:

Male. I have worked with several female match officials who are offended, saddened but also not surprised by the lack of accommodation for female officials through football.

Offended?!! Cmon!! 

Firstly there isn't a lack of accommodation for female officials....... There's a lack of accommodation for both male and female at same time.... There is a difference. 

Secondly.... Hopefully in time this situation improves but just suddenly creating another changing room.... With showers... Isn't as easy as you seem to think.... And costly. 

BUT I do hope in time it happens 

[mattelot]

1 hour ago, FootballChat said:

Male. I have worked with several female match officials who are offended, saddened but also not surprised by the lack of accommodation for female officials through football.

I can certainly see your point .But unless a club has a brand new purpose built clubhouse / changing rooms with those facilities included or don't have the space to reconfigure their existing facilities ,what in your opinion can be done other than say the FA not appointing female officials to matches where there aren't the seperate necessary facilities.

But then I suppose that opens another can of worms due to the shortage of officials .

[Barry H]

 

1 hour ago, FootballChat said:

Yes. Offended.

Offended by the fact that almost all of the clubs at step 6 and above would rather ‘invest’ in their playing squad than provide facilities for women.

I don’t want to pick on Sticker as they’re a lovely club but they have, in the last few years, built an extension to their facilities and fully refurbished. Is there a space for female officials to change? No.

Helston & Mousehole have spent a small fortune on their squads and grounds yet still neglect female friendly facilities.

I get it that clubs like Bodmin & Falmouth will struggle due to the age of the stands etc but enough money is spent elsewhere at these clubs (and many others!) that it clearly shows that providing basic facilities for females is far from a priority.

Football is no longer a “man’s game” and it’s time clubs moved with this.

I don’t expect the issue to be resolved overnight but I would like to see the FA and leagues amend their ground grading criteria and give existing clubs a set time period to create suitable changing facilities that cater for the increasing number of female match officials.

If all Step 6+ clubs were told they have 3 years to develop their facilities or face penalties/demotions I guarantee the clubs would find the money & space to comply.

Incorrect, Helston have a door at each end of the officials changing room with a door in the middle that allows the room to be split into two, with separate exits for when we have a mix of female and male officials.

[The Town Man]

Just out of interest, how many female officials are there at step 6 in the South West? Struggling to remember ever seeing one at Falmouth?

Hopefully there will be more in the future, but until numbers increase it would seem a large expense to add new changing rooms at every club, just in case the odd female official should appear.

Agree that all new-builds or large extensions etc. should really now make provisions though if there is a trend for more female officials.

[FootballChat]

6 hours ago, GKBH said:

 

Incorrect, Helston have a door at each end of the officials changing room with a door in the middle that allows the room to be split into two, with separate exits for when we have a mix of female and male officials.

You are correct! Apologies!

5 hours ago, The Town Man said:

Just out of interest, how many female officials are there at step 6 in the South West? Struggling to remember ever seeing one at Falmouth?

Hopefully there will be more in the future, but until numbers increase it would seem a large expense to add new changing rooms at every club, just in case the odd female official should appear.

Agree that all new-builds or large extensions etc. should really now make provisions though if there is a trend for more female officials.

I’m unsure on the exact numbers but this season alone I’ve seen 5 different female officials operating at SWPL and Western League level in the south west.

[BrummyBarry]

Not that my opinion matters on this subject as Im a male and I cant just imagine how each woman feels when in this situation. However my opinion is that there just isnt enough females in the game to warrant the expenditure of creating rooms especially for them at grounds which are primarily used for males (those without female teams). I do agree with what a few have said and that is that special measures should be put in place at these clubs immediately upon receipt of the email from the fa that they are being appointed a female referee. However I was also told this evening that the emails don't actually say if a person is male or female. So a female with the same name as a male (I know Bob's, Alex's, Ashley's and Casey's), may not see that a female has been appointed. Along with my club friend I also asked a referee that I know and he said that what referees at this level would normally do is exactly the same as they would with a youth referee under 18. That referee would go into the changing room first and get changed. Once changed, they would then swap and the other two would get changed whilst the other waited outside, got a drink or something. Once all changed they would then warm up and continue as normal. Exactly the same at the end of the game, they would alternate and take turns. A logical way of doing it. I think that most female referees and young referees understand the logistical issue that this presents and whilst it may frustrate them, they are relatively okay with it. Of course they would prefer separate changing rooms but they most probably understand the issues clubs face considering that unlike players, referees must start right at the bottom at the poorest of clubs.

[We Two]

11 hours ago, FootballChat said:

don’t want to pick on Sticker as they’re a lovely club but they have, in the last few years, built an extension to their facilities and fully refurbished. Is there a space for female officials to change? No.

We believe that you are wrong regarding Sticker FootballChat, as explained to us by one of their members when we questioned them, they included in their refurbishment a seperate unit within the clubhouse that doubles as a changing room for female officials complete with shower etc, and is also completely furnished for disabled use.
Perhaps a pointer for clubs to cater for two aspects of the games facilities for two completely different groups that are rarely if ever considered at football grounds at this level.
Our grandaughter was also pleasantly surprised to find that there were baby changing facilities available at this club , talk about catching em young !.
 
 

[Footy follower]

15 minutes ago, We Two said:

We believe that you are wrong regarding Sticker FootballChat, as explained to us by one of their members when we questioned them, they included in their refurbishment a seperate unit within the clubhouse that doubles as a changing room for female officials complete with shower etc, and is also completely furnished for disabled use.
Perhaps a pointer for clubs to cater for two aspects of the games facilities for two completely different groups that are rarely if ever considered at football grounds at this level.
Our grandaughter was also pleasantly surprised to find that there were baby changing facilities available at this club , talk about catching em young !.
 
 

Football chat seems to not have done his research

[Toroloco13]

Ground grading at both steps state that provisions should be made for both male and female officials and when building new facilities/refurbishing, separate facilities must be provided 

[Dave Deacon]

Yes clubs have to take reasonable steps when having female or under 18's, but providing actual compliant separate changing rooms is necessary only when building new dressing rooms or undertaking substantial, grant subsidised, overhauling of existing facilities.

[Tommy Matthews]

All new changing room builds have to accommodate female officials I think you’ll find. Take a look at Wadebridge’s set up which is superb. 
When we ran the Cornwall Youth Team and Sam Boston was our physio, I always felt guilty that wherever we went she had to change in some store cupboard or similar. 

[Ian Pethick]

3 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

Yes clubs have to take reasonable steps when having female or under 18's, but providing actual compliant separate changing rooms is necessary only when building new dressing rooms or undertaking substantial, grant subsidised, overhauling of existing facilities.

Believe that Bolitho Park had separate female changing and showering facilities when the new clubhouse was built back in 2013.

[Billy Jacka]

We Have a separate changing room toilet and shower for female officials at Trungle next door to the main officials changing room only had to use it once to my knowledge so far  

[Tommy Matthews]

You never know what the future brings, maybe two female officials will use the main changing room one day with a male in the new one? 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Gary Hocking]

So, the person who publicly called out Sticker, Helston & Mousehole for their lack of female-friendly officials’ changing facilities turns out to have been wrong in all three cases 🤔 

[We Two]

Regardless of who has what that accomodates females, either as officials of players, surely clubs will benefit if every effort is made to accommodate them in the game.
IF everyone spent money improving facilities at their club instead of wasting it trying to win an EPNS plated cup, we may see an upsurge in the interest in football, the Lionesses success will support that theory.
Why is it that the reputed many thousands of pounds available to clubs seldom seems to appear to improve spectator facilities, is that because they don't apply for a grant or is grant money being spent elsewhere?
For every female official that officiates at a match, someone is released to possibly officiate at a junior match where they are crying out for referees.

[Dave Deacon]

3 hours ago, We Two said:

is that because they don't apply for a grant or is grant money being spent elsewhere?

Or could it be that the club can’t raise the % they normally have to provide?

[We Two]

55 minutes ago, Dave Deacon said:

4 hours ago, We Two said:

is that because they don't apply for a grant or is grant money being spent elsewhere?

Or could it be that the club can’t raise the % they normally have to provide?

Exactly the point we were making Dave, spend less on players who take money out of the clubs, and spend more on the spectators that put their money in to the clubs.
Some of the so called big clubs in the league have a great deal to do to improve their supporters facilities up to the standard of some of their smaller peers.
Like several others on the forum we have no idea how much is actually paid to players, but if some of the figures quoted are anywhere near correct, it wouldn't take long to raise the money needed if wages were at a sensible and sustainable level.