Jump to content
Cornwall Football Forum

Recommended Posts

I have some huge gaps in my knowledge and information in the county prior to the South Western League starting in 1951.

I think there was a Cornwall County League and a Cornwall Senior League operating in the late 40's and early fifties, but I can't seem to find much about either of these leagues.

Could anyone help to enlighten me - Would love some league tables for these leagues if anyone has them, or a list of teams that were participating, or any general info at all on these leagues.

Many Thanks

Paul

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Prior to the South Western League the Cornwall Senior cup was played on a league basis with the Final between the winners of the East Division against the West.

I have some programmes of the Senior cup finals (late 40's) which show the clubs in the two groups.

I can in due course list the clubs who competed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cornwall Senior League

DIVISION 1 1958-59

TEAM PL WON DRAW LOST FOR AGAINST POINTS

ST JUST 20 15 3 2 57 26 33

NEWQUAY RESERVES 20 13 2 5 49 34 28

PORTHLEVEN 20 12 3 5 67 52 27

NANPEAN ROVERS 20 10 5 5 57 29 25

RAF ST MAWGAN 20 10 3 7 59 42 23

ST DENNIS 20 8 3 9 45 44 19

FALMOUTH TOWN RESERVES 19 7 2 10 42 44 16

PENZANCE RESERVES 20 6 2 12 34 46 14

HELSTON ATHLETIC RESERVES 19 6 2 11 28 44 14

RNAS CULDROSE 20 5 1 14 41 72 11

BODMIN PHH 20 4 0 16 39 85 8

DIVISION 2 1958-59

TEAM PL WON DRAW LOST FOR AGAINST POINTS

ROCHE 18 14 2 2 57 21 30

ST BREWARD 18 13 1 4 65 31 27

BUGLE 18 12 2 4 53 38 26

FALMOUTH DOCKS 18 8 6 4 59 31 22

MARAZION BLUES 18 7 5 6 46 40 19

MULLION 18 6 4 8 36 40 16

CAMELFORD 18 5 4 9 42 60 14

MOUSEHOLE 18 5 2 11 38 65 12

RNAS CULDROSE RESERVES 18 2 4 12 41 68 8

ST COLUMB MINOR 18 2 2 14 20 63 6

Each Division also had their own cup competitions and the results from the 1958-59 season were

DIVISION 1

NANPEAN ROVERS 4-4 HELSTON ATHLETIC RESERVES

REPLAY

HELSTON ATHLETIC RESERVES 2-3 NANPEAN ROVERS

- - - - -

DIVISION 2

MULLION 2-1 ROCHE

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Senior League 1931/32- 1959/60

This league was introduced because Cornish clubs finally rebelled against the Plymouth and District League's 16 mile radius rule which meant that clubs outside the area had to pay all the travelling costs of the visiting team.

The Western Evening Herald offered a perpetual trophy for the winners of this new competition, and it was inscribed, "Cornish Senior League presented by the Western Evening Herald 1931"It was valued at 25 guineas and became known as the Herald Cup.Teams participating in the first year and finishing in this order were, Truro City, St. Austell, Wadebridge, St. Dennis, R.N. Barracks, Newquay Rovers, Looe, Saltash Town, St. Blazey, Liskeard,Millbrook, Torpoint, Bodmin Town and Launceston.

.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Looking at the official programme

1948-49 Cornwall Senior Cup Final played at Poltair Park 18th.April 1949 2pm

PENZANCE v St.AUSTELL

Runners Up Match

TRURO CITY v WADEBRIDGE

Listed in order of League Position

East Division-

st.Austell-Wadebridge-Camelford-Bugle-Saltash-Tintagel-Bodmin-Millbrook-Torpoint-St.Blazey-Callington-Burraton-Launceston-Liskeard-Looe-Bude-Torpoint Social

West division-

Penzance-Truro City-Nanpean-Helston-NewquayMullion-R A F st.Eval-St.Just-Mousehole-Broadlane-Porthleven-Fraddon-Falmouth Docks-St.Dennis-RNAS St.Merryn-RNAS Culdrose

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mike

If i'm not mistaken, that 48/49 final at Poltair was played in front of 16,000!

Never seen any documenatry evidence of that (and i certainly wasn't there!!) but I think that's right. Pretty remarkable really but the grass banks behind each goal and large 'bottom' bank would certainly hold vast numbers back then...before health & safety was an issue.

Those were the days.

By the way, do Burraton and Broad Lane (where?) even exist now? Don't think Fraddon have a team either (where did they play?).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Cornwall Combination League was set up for the start of the 1959-60 season. Other leagues in existence at that time were the South Western League, Mining League and Cornwall Senior League.

The Cornwall Combination League grew out of the Cornwall Senior League. In the 1958-59 season there were 2 divisions of the Cornwall Senior League and from a break-up of the league came the 12 original members of the Combination League.

From Division 1, St Just, Newquay Reserves, Porthleven, Nanpean Rovers, RAF St Mawgan, Helston Reserves, St Dennis, Falmouth Town Reserves, Penzance Reserves and RNAS Culdrose join the Combo and from the 2nd Division Falmouth Docks, St Breward and Roche also join.

At first RNAS Culdrose were refused entry into the Combination League as the league said that they would put a reserve side into the Combination League leaving their more senior side in the Senior League but RNAS Culdrose assured them they would put their senior side into the Combination League and reserves into the Senior League. Thus they were allowed to join the Combination League.

The Cornwall Senior League folded at the end of the 1959-60 season.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mike

If i'm not mistaken, that 48/49 final at Poltair was played in front of 16,000!

Never seen any documenatry evidence of that (and i certainly wasn't there!!) but I think that's right. Pretty remarkable really but the grass banks behind each goal and large 'bottom' bank would certainly hold vast numbers back then...before health & safety was an issue.

Those were the days.

By the way, do Burraton and Broad Lane (where?) even exist now? Don't think Fraddon have a team either (where did they play?).

Mike

If i'm not mistaken, that 48/49 final at Poltair was played in front of 16,000!

Never seen any documenatry evidence of that (and i certainly wasn't there!!) but I think that's right. Pretty remarkable really but the grass banks behind each goal and large 'bottom' bank would certainly hold vast numbers back then...before health & safety was an issue.

Those were the days.

By the way, do Burraton and Broad Lane (where?) even exist now? Don't think Fraddon have a team either (where did they play?).

Tony-

You are right about the big gates at Poltair Park for the Senior Cup finals at that time.

St.Austell was the preferred venue due to it being the most central ground connected by the railway for travelling fans.

And the address of the CCFA

Broadlane is the road leading to Illogan from Camborne/Redruth

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would like to give some information to this topic as my late father W J Richards (Jimmy) played in both finals for Penzance - 1947/48, 1948/49. He played at right-half. The Magpies set a scoring record in the Cornwall Senior Cup competition and almost achieved a 'double' in successive seasons: The Senior Cup and Charity Cup, they unfortunately lost the Senior Cup final in 1948/49. They reached the final of Senior Cup by defeating Liskeard 12-0, it was played on a league basis. Member teams being: Falmouth Docks, Liskeard, St Merryn, Helston, RNAS Culdrose, St Dennis, St Just, Truro, Wadebridge, Newquay, Bugle, St Eval, Nanpean, Camelford, St Blazey.

Result of 1947/48 final defeating St Blazey 4-2 (scorers Gerry Gazzard, Stan Harris, Ray Boase and Tim Timbrell). The gate was 12,000. They won the Charity Cup by defeating Bugle 3-1.

The following season they reached the Senior Cup final scoring 196 goals on the way. It was played on a league basis, the best of the West versus the best of the East. The final was labelled the big shoot-out, St Austell v Penzance, on this occasion St Austell on their home ground won 2-0, with a ground record of 13,000.

St Austell team: V Bethel, V Brown, L Rowe, F J Lobb, R C Roberts, W J Kellow, G Hoskin, A Bowyer, R L Williams, N D Lobb, M Ward.

Penzance: R J Miners, K Cocks, W D Jago, W J Richards, E J Skinner, S Harris, T Warner, G Gazzard, H Timbrell, R E Boase, C Sutherley.

Incidently they defeated Newquay in the Charity Cup 4-3 in the final at Helston.

I have my father's winning plaque and losers medal.

In May of 1949 Cornwall played Tottenham Hotspur at the Penzance & Newlyn rugby ground - they were still playing at St Clare the cricket field which was also shared with the hockey club - 10,000 fans turned out at the Mennaye Field to see Cornwall lose 2-0. After that game Gerry Gazzard turned professional with West Ham at the age of 24.

I think I will leave some other stories for another day.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To all those that have posted on this thread, all I can say is wow, your detailed knowledge is amazing, I hope the info keeps coming.

In my naivety, for me football in Cornwall started in 1951 with the SW League, I had read or seen very little about what was happening in the county before then, so just made a very bad assumption that the Senior scene was fairly limited to a few clubs involvement in the Plymouth & District League.

How wrong I was ! and I have to say how pleased I am I was, the info everyone is giving is fascinating.

I was particularly interested in the info around those attendances for the 48 & 49 finals, I have been doing research into the Reading & District League and that really was a boom time for football everywhere by the looks of things, Berks & Bucks Cup finals were attracting reportedly 20,000+ crowds to Elm Park, immediately after the war.

Also - A name that I was aware of in the area was RAF St Mawgan, my father was posted there in the late fifties for his National Service and I remember him regailing many a tail of the football down there when he was playing in the same team as a lot of famous Pro & Semi-Pro players. Despite these so called 'stars' they never won a great deal as it seems that they were more worried about picking up injuries and ruining their careers after National Service than playing full bloodied. Sounds similar to todays club v country debate !

Once again all, many thanks and looking forward to reading more.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

During my research on another topic, newspaper cuttings of the day gave attendance figures for the 1946/47, 1947/48 and 1948/49 Senior Cup Finals as 10,000, 10,000 and 13,000 respectively. Apparently the 1946/47 final was a record to that date with £674.10 taken in cash, this tallies with gates nationally after the Second World War.It is also interesting to note that St. Austell had a monopoly as the Senior Cup venue for many many years.

Pauloslam also mentions R.A.F. St. Mawgan. My late husband also did his National Service at St. Mawgan, starting in 1955. In 1954 a new competition

was started, The Battle of Britain Cup, to be played annually between 19 Group R.A.F.and Newquay F.C. I have several programmes of this competition, but an example is the team of 1959, C. Baker, J. Robertson, Sgt. Brown, K. Tebbutt, D. Davies, H. Stopport, D. Rowden and Pitman all St. Mawgan,G. Earle (Bally Kelly) and S.Griffiths(Locking, Shrewsbury Town). The Newquay Club have talked about reviving the competition, against some form of Her Majesty's Forces team. The trophy is still in the cabinet at Mount Wise.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would like to give some information to this topic as my late father W J Richards (Jimmy) played in both finals for Penzance - 1947/48, 1948/49. He played at right-half. The Magpies set a scoring record in the Cornwall Senior Cup competition and almost achieved a 'double' in successive seasons: The Senior Cup and Charity Cup, they unfortunately lost the Senior Cup final in 1948/49. They reached the final of Senior Cup by defeating Liskeard 12-0, it was played on a league basis. Member teams being: Falmouth Docks, Liskeard, St Merryn, Helston, RNAS Culdrose, St Dennis, St Just, Truro, Wadebridge, Newquay, Bugle, St Eval, Nanpean, Camelford, St Blazey.

Result of 1947/48 final defeating St Blazey 4-2 (scorers Gerry Gazzard, Stan Harris, Ray Boase and Tim Timbrell). The gate was 12,000. They won the Charity Cup by defeating Bugle 3-1.

The following season they reached the Senior Cup final scoring 196 goals on the way. It was played on a league basis, the best of the West versus the best of the East. The final was labelled the big shoot-out, St Austell v Penzance, on this occasion St Austell on their home ground won 2-0, with a ground record of 13,000.

St Austell team: V Bethel, V Brown, L Rowe, F J Lobb, R C Roberts, W J Kellow, G Hoskin, A Bowyer, R L Williams, N D Lobb, M Ward.

Penzance: R J Miners, K Cocks, W D Jago, W J Richards, E J Skinner, S Harris, T Warner, G Gazzard, H Timbrell, R E Boase, C Sutherley.

Incidently they defeated Newquay in the Charity Cup 4-3 in the final at Helston.

I have my father's winning plaque and losers medal.

In May of 1949 Cornwall played Tottenham Hotspur at the Penzance & Newlyn rugby ground - they were still playing at St Clare the cricket field which was also shared with the hockey club - 10,000 fans turned out at the Mennaye Field to see Cornwall lose 2-0. After that game Gerry Gazzard turned professional with West Ham at the age of 24.

I think I will leave some other stories for another day.

It's lovely to see some of those names that I've heard growing up supporting St.Austell - Bill Kellow, Noah Lobb, Vic Brown etc. Equally I remember Gerry Gazzard from his days with Penzance after playing....was he on the committee or the SWL committee, my memory is fading!

Interesting to see you quote a crowd figure of 13,000. Folklore told me 16,000. I wonder what it was exactly....St.Austell had turnstiles in 3 corners of the ground up until recent years (with working numbering system) so maybe the CCFA records have the exact figure. Whatever it was it was still one hell of a lot!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gerry Gazzard was the secretary of the old South Western League for many years as well as Penzance.

Interesting about professional clubs playing here in Cornwall. I have programmes from more recent years including QPR v Truro ('88); PZ v Leicester City ('97); PZ v Leicester City ('96); PZ v Liverpool ('92) signed; PZ v Sheffield Wednesday ('92) signed; PZ v Liverpool, PZ v Plymouth Argyle ('89) all signed; PZ v Celtic ('89); PZ v Liverpool ('88); PZ v Torquay Utd ('97).

PZ v Barnet ('60); PZ v Wycombe Wanderers ('57); PZ v Clapton Ath ('57); PZ v Leicester City ('55); PZ v Stoke City ('55); PZ v West Ham ('54); PZ v Walthamstow Avenue ('54 amateur); PZ v Brentford ('53) signed Tommy Lawton etc; PZ v Luton Town ('52); PZ v West Ham ('52); PZ v Torquay Utd ('51); PZ v Corinthian Casuals ('49 amateur).

Numerous Cornwall programmes, interesting one when they played a Caribbean XI in 1959 and Aston Villa in 1947.

I will post some interesting facts about Junior clubs in the West Cornwall area when time permits.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...