Trelawny AGM

[Sijames]

Do current Trelawny Clubs want to see more teams enter next season into the leagues? I've seen a lot of discussion about it and would be interested to see what the 'publics' opinion is on it before the AGM this week, vote away!

[WendronOfficial]

I don't think it's as simple as yes / no. I think a lot depends on the structure and plan of the club as well as the context. I'm not 100% on the protocol but I think that new clubs should have to submit a 5 year plan to show sustainability. 

I'm all for new clubs forming and opportunities for participation but you get into the age old debate that it is players already playing within well established sides that go and form new teams, leaving their current side in trouble. 

[Sijames]

Unfortunately though on the night there isn't time to go through such topics for each and every new team. I agree with your comment about taking players from one club to another etc, which is why I think entries should cease for a few years, get some stability back to the Trelawny league and local clubs.

it is far to easy to enter the leagues in my eyes, just a matter of a vote at a meeting and you're potentially in the league! How on earth is this correct? Personally think all teams wishing to enter the leagues should have to submit a club plan, financial plan to the Trelawny league or ccfa for them to see exactly how much work has been put into this team / club and if they deserve a place or not!

[Dave Bartlam]

Who says that plans aren't in place for teams to do just that Sijames? There are plans in place but with anything, these things take time to implement.

If you've got spare time on your hands, try and create your own divisions without the new teams that have applied... then create one with the new teams that have applied. I'm of the opinion that if these teams weren't to be accepted, we will be losing yet another division! To not accept them would be a mistake (again, just my personal opinion). We have to encourage participation. With less teams, less players get a chance to play. More players then walk away from the game. With these new teams joining, the league has become more stable. Less movement up and down, there's no teams who finished in eighth place being promoted as they have done in seasons gone by. The league is starting to balance itself out nicely. Division 4 and 3 will always be the two divisions mostly affected by change.

With the loss of West Cornwall, Pendeen, Newbridge, Mabe Reserves and Four Lanes Resrves, the divisions need to balance themselves out. By accepting the new teams, that is what happens. If the unfortunate were to happen during the season and these teams were to fold, we would be in no worse position than we would if we didn't allow them to join.

There are thousands of players that have not re-registered over the past few seasons. Some of those players are getting back involved in the game. I alone have spoken to four people who didn't register to play last season who are now going training with clubs. There are plenty of players around, we just have to find them.

Instead of being negative about it, try and help the situation. We all know people that have stopped playing the game; encourage them to start playing again. Kidnap their wives/girlfriends, get them fired from their jobs or something. 

Participation drops significantly as players reach the 32 year mark... Whilst we encourage everyone at all ages to play, this is where we could do better. There were guys as old as 65 signed on last season!

If you look where the new teams are located, they aren't going to have a massive geographical affect on the clubs around them.

My opinions on here of course are my own.

[Sijames]

'Instead of being negative about it'. Hang on a minute young man, do not assume my appeal for no teams to be elected into the leagues as negatively, you are far from being correct (a surprise I know for you). It will be a positive step forward for this to be implemented by the league. All you are trying to justify is that by allowing new teams / clubs to enter the leagues you are facilitating maximum participation, all you are actually doing is watering down current teams and clubs and thinning their potential teams and squads down and down!

You are very narrow minded and blinkered towards your own ideas and not the bigger picture, which is what we should all be looking at especially someone in your position.

[Dave Bartlam]

 

The rules are the rules. Take a look at them. So long as the teams who are applying adhere to the rules - they are considered for entry by the clubs. No rule change proposals have been put forward to suggest that the league implement a system similar to what you suggest... So, what can the league do? If you want the changes and you are associated to a club, put them forward and they will be considered.

Im always open to new ideas to make things better and to increase participation. Obviously there's only so much you know about me  

Lets not get personal here!!!

[Sijames]

As you state 'rules are rules', I am asking clubs to use their votes wisely, back what the public think and have the minerals to say 'NO'!

you have already stated that something like this is being looked at and is planned in, but takes time, so I nor anyone else needs to suggest them do they? What are you talking about? If I, an old man involved now with a club can see this needs doing and I'm confident others can see it also, you should also see this and so should the ccfa or is it more about the £££££? Turning teams away would have a financial hit on the leagues and ccfa I guess, quick to take money off of clubs but not so quick to ensure the current clubs best interests are considered!!!

[Dave Bartlam]

It's absolutely nothing to do with finance. Nothing in any of my posts suggests that; let me take you back to my first response.. "We have to encourage participation. With less teams, less players get a chance to play. More players walk away from the game". There is certainly no way I have implied that it's about money. It is about retaining the players we have, whilst getting new players into the game and the players that haven't re-registered back. Let's bare in mind the fact that many teams fold due to a lack of volunteers, not a lack of players.

My focus is to keep the players we have in the game, to get the youngsters into the game and to try and get at least a small percentage of the 2000+ players who have failed to re-register in recent seasons back involved in the game. To suggest that my intentions lie elsewhere would be hugely incorrect.

I disagree with your opinion that we should stop teams joining the league. But, I respect the fact that you have an opinion and I respect your right to voice that opinion. I would encourage you as a club member to use your vote (if it's you that's voting on behalf of your club) wisely, whatever choice that may be.

Lets not twist what I write though. 

[Sijames]

I'm not twisting anything, your aim to to retain the players with have, but by adding new clubs you won't retain them, you'll end up making them quit as their club will have probably lost 5-6-7 players to a 'new' club, meaning theirs will fold and it starts all over again! It's a vicious circle that until you stop the new teams entering will never even itself out. 

Stop it for 2-3 seasons and you'll have clubs thriving with players on the pitch, people behind the scenes, clubhouses full and you'll not see any games unable to be played due to teams not able to raise a side! Again by adding new teams you are not facilitating you are thinning the current clubs and teams potential signings far and wide, it has to stop.

[Dave Bartlam]

My argument is... a team can only name 16 players on any given game. At this level, all 16 can play and substitute freely (well done FA on that). 

So, let's look at it this way. Without the new teams that want to join, this season we would have 64 teams (without looking at my computer). Sixteen players at 64 teams = 1024 players. We had 1340 players registered this season (again, I'm not looking at my computer, but the figure is there or there abouts). What are you going to do/say to the other 316 players each week that can't play a game of football? You're going to force them out of the game. You've got to look at it from a few angles. 

By stopping teams entering the league, I'm of the opinion that you will actually make things worse, based on the statistics I have provided above.

I get what you are saying, but I just don't think stopping teams joining the league is the way to achieve good. The participation in the game is in decline nationwide, not just here in Cornwall.

[Sijames]

Sorry are you implying that those 16 were the same 16 every week? Ridiculous attempt at trying to justify the impossible again! Most teams require the difference you've stated throughout the season, that's a given, there's your normality and difference !

[Dave Bartlam]

I'm being realistic. You will be turning people away. I'm not even sure if the FA would allow the league to stop teams applying.

I'm just about done on this topic, we will be going round in circles otherwise. 

Look, if you don't want teams to be accepted into the league, use your clubs vote to reflect that. Stage a protest, come on here and lead a campaign to get all clubs to say no if that's what you want to do. 

There are two sides to it; yours and mine. That doesn't mean that either of us are wrong. 

Introduce yourself to me at the AGM, it would be good to put a name/face to the alias.

[Steve Carpenter]

4 hours ago, WendronOfficial said:

I don't think it's as simple as yes / no. I think a lot depends on the structure and plan of the club as well as the context. I'm not 100% on the protocol but I think that new clubs should have to submit a 5 year plan to show sustainability. 

There is nothing anywhere that requires clubs to have a 5 year plan.  If this requirement were to be applied then, if you're looking to ensure club longevity, it would also have to apply to current clubs.  All new member clubs have to achieve Charter Standard status within a year and this is the FA vehicle that attempts to ensure stability.

As for Sijames arguments the following may help in fleshing out the bigger picture:

• The League Constitution is for three divisions of 14 and two of 15.  There have been no proposals to change this.
• With the clubs/teams being promoted to the Combination League, resigning at the end of and withdrawing during last season there will obviously be vacancies in the bottom division.
• When combined this is not too dissimilar to the situation that the FHL and MDFL had every season.
• The loss of clubs/teams every season is always a concern but the reasons vary greatly and players moving from one club to form another has only happened on a very small number of occasions.
• At the end of every season about a third of all players do not re-register for the following season.
• Between 25% and a third of players change clubs from the end of one season to the start of the next.  A further 10% transfer during the season.
• About a third of all players change their address each season.
• Given the last three points virtually no club can guarantee keeping the same players or numbers that they had the previous season.
• The focus from the FA has moved from 'growth' to 'sustainment' due to the national and international picture.  To refuse entry to any club or team would need very, very good grounds.  Without them an appeal to the FA would almost certainly be successful. 
• To suggest that stopping new clubs joining will stop the drop off is, in my view, naive and will rapidly result in the League shrinking even further. If this policy were to be applied this season the bottom division would have 7 teams.  That is clearly not sustainable so then what?
• At the level we are operating at the game is about having people playing for enjoyment and that's what we are here to facilitate.

2 hours ago, Sijames said:

or is it more about the £££££? Turning teams away would have a financial hit on the leagues and ccfa I guess, quick to take money off of clubs but not so quick to ensure the current clubs best interests are considered!!!

This is an unnecessary slight on those that run the game locally and does not reflect well on you I'm afraid.  Apart from the fixed costs the only other expenses are those incurred by misconduct or failing to comply with rules and regulations i.e. they are with the control of the clubs.  The loss of a £35 League affiliation fee is hardly going to break the bank.

There are many other flaws in the points you raise above  Sijames but I'm not going to go on forever.  Quite frankly if yours turns out to be the majority view and it prevails at the AGM then I'm glad I'm going to be out of it. 

 

[Paul Collings]

1 hour ago, B_D said:

Without the new teams that want to join, this season we would have 64 teams . Sixteen players at 64 teams = 1024 players. We had 1340 players registered this season . What are you going to do/say to the other 316 players each week that can't play a game of football?

I think it is a fortunate team that can survive all season on just 16 registered players. I would have thought 21 is a more realistic figure, so that's 21 x 64 = 1344 !!

I wish your league well for the new season whatever you decide and look forward to venturing west to catch a few Junior Cups games. Can our Duchy dominance continue ??

[Steve Carpenter]

7 minutes ago, Paul Collings said:

I think it is a fortunate team that can survive all season on just 16 registered players. I would have thought 21 is a more realistic figure, so that's 21 x 64 = 1344 !!

I wish your league well for the new season whatever you decide and look forward to venturing west to catch a few Junior Cups games. Can our Duchy dominance continue ??

Fortunate would be an understatement Paul!!  The average number of players per team last season was 37 with the lowest single team club figure being 23.

I'll be away for the Junior Cup final next season but we have some strong teams down west that I'm sure can put a dent in your record.

[marrabean]

I think if a club has the intention to join the league they should have the apply two seasons running! This to me shows someone has the drive and clarity of thought to follow it through for a prolonged period of time! Not a group of lads purely looking for a pitch to hire and play on as a collective! I am not suggesting everyone wants to build a Falmouth Town or Helston but clubs should be expected to sustain there involvement for a period of time! 

[Sijames]

Some concrete answers and facts Steve which is appreciated! With regards to the bottom division only potentially consisting of 7 teams, surly it isn't to hard to change the constitution? To open it up to have less leagues with more teams etc?

[Steve Carpenter]

49 minutes ago, marrabean said:

I think if a club has the intention to join the league they should have the apply two seasons running! This to me shows someone has the drive and clarity of thought to follow it through for a prolonged period of time! Not a group of lads purely looking for a pitch to hire and play on as a collective! I am not suggesting everyone wants to build a Falmouth Town or Helston but clubs should be expected to sustain there involvement for a period of time! 

A not entirely unreasonable idea and one that is partially being addressed by the introduction of Flexi Football.  This is being rolled out across the County and is aimed at specific targeted audiences one of which is newly formed teams with ambitions to progress into Saturday football.  The aim is for them to can get themselves established both player wise and financially before making that step.  The FA model is for this to come under league umbrellas (i.e. in our case it would be Trelawny Flexi) and the option to run the west Cornwall Flexi League under Trelawny will be put to the clubs at the AGM.  If that is voted down the CCFA will run it. 

23 minutes ago, Sijames said:

Some concrete answers and facts Steve which is appreciated! With regards to the bottom division only potentially consisting of 7 teams, surly it isn't to hard to change the constitution? To open it up to have less leagues with more teams etc?

The constitution can be amended but there are timelines that we are obliged to adhere to.  Any change put forward could now only take place at the commencement of 18-19 season and even then past experience tells us that you're realistically only talking about a maximum of 15 teams per division.  

The FA briefing I attended about the reduction in participation across ALL team sports across the country and indeed Europe was quite sobering.  Over the last few years it's been about a managed retreat but but I do believe that we are now pretty much stable in our part of the County.  There will always be turbulence at the end of each season, there always has been in more modern times but I'm pretty confident that we've now bottomed out. 

[Bobjfh]

I think that while the FA continue to mark its own success by the number of 'new' teams then they are part of the actual problem. You can get funding (for kit and set up costs) for a 'new' team but not for bringing  an existing u16 youth team (at your club) through into men's football - if they go to another club they can get funding??

Flexi football is, in my opinion, an extension of this - create new flexi teams, which will still take from the 'existing' pool of players - I can't see this attracting extra players - if they want to progress to Saturday football, they will join Saturday teams.

Clubs CAN ask questions at the AGM, there is no time limit, do that and vote per application - Si I disagree with your 'survey' as whilst a genuine concern of many of us, you are 'lumping' all applications together. Some new clubs/teams have a better set up than many current clubs - give them a chance. 

I would also suggest that clubs should listen to the League committee advice and the proposals they put forward - there is a lot of experience there. 

[Richard Rundle]

What players are going to be wanting to play friendlies or whatever "Flexi Football" will bring? Players will migrate to teams playing real games and the team will then get accused of being non-sustainable and we're back Square One.

[Jacob-Englefield]

I am in favour of new clubs/teams entering the Trelawny League. However, like a few have mentioned already, you've got to be careful about who you let in. I think those who wish to enter the league have to prove that they are serious about joining the league and that they'll continue to compete in the league for so many years after joining. Something like a 5 year plan would definitely help them prove to the league that they'll be around for the long term rather than the short term.

[Martin Eddy]

I agree with Bobjfh share any concerns at the AGM to the applying clubs before the vote.pexpletives will work out from the answers how organised these teams are. Don't forget there will be a lot of experience in the room on wednesday. Most of the club reps have been to one or two meetings. As stated above by Steve current members would have to provide a 5 year plan as well and with the experience we have seen before you can have a 20 year plan but if a whole team walks away from your club you are up a Creek without a paddle

[WendronOfficial]

@Steve Carpenter you are amazing. 

St Kew in the East are a great example of a team entering a league; they've played Sunday League for several seasons, established themselves, and are now entering as a Saturday side in the Duchy. A good model to follow I think. 

[Dave Bartlam]

Just to reference the Flexi-Football, it isn't aimed at our current crop of players. It will be aimed more at youth and those that are not registered to the league. You'll hear more about this at the AGM on Wednesday Steve and Scooby are the guys clued up on this at the moment so they can (and will at the AGM) shed more light on it.

Many of you have valid points regarding the new teams, points which will be listened to. For me, I think we have to work hard as a collective to get more people [back] involved in the game. There were many players who simply walk away from the game and don't come back. Camborne Athletic folded, I can count on one hand how many of those guys re-registered with another club. The rest just dropped off the radar and haven't been seen on a football pitch since. Where do they go? How do we get them back?

How many guys do we know that played football, who are still young enough, fit enough and good enough to kick a ball around the pitch? Lets get them back into the game! We struggle with numbers (and have historically) for the 32-34 age range. That's where we lose people.

Only 130 players failed to re-register this season from the 2015/16 season; that's compared to 291 between 14/15 and 15/16. So, we are still losing people at an alarming rate, but the drop on the previous season in terms of players leaving has actually increased.

 

[Jacob-Englefield]

1 hour ago, B_D said:

Just to reference the Flexi-Football, it isn't aimed at our current crop of players. It will be aimed more at youth and those that are not registered to the league. You'll hear more about this at the AGM on Wednesday Steve and Scooby are the guys clued up on this at the moment so they can (and will at the AGM) shed more light on it.

Many of you have valid points regarding the new teams, points which will be listened to. For me, I think we have to work hard as a collective to get more people [back] involved in the game. There were many players who simply walk away from the game and don't come back. Camborne Athletic folded, I can count on one hand how many of those guys re-registered with another club. The rest just dropped off the radar and haven't been seen on a football pitch since. Where do they go? How do we get them back?

How many guys do we know that played football, who are still young enough, fit enough and good enough to kick a ball around the pitch? Lets get them back into the game! We struggle with numbers (and have historically) for the 32-34 age range. That's where we lose people.

Only 130 players failed to re-register this season from the 2015/16 season; that's compared to 291 between 14/15 and 15/16. So, we are still losing people at an alarming rate, but the drop on the previous season in terms of players leaving has actually increased.

 

Dave, there are a lot of players who leave the game. Be it because their previous team has folded, they've lost interest or they just want to simply retire from football. In all honesty, there's only so much the FA and County FA can do to stop players walking away from the game, particularly when they are still too young to give up. Surely there can't be many options left?

[Dave Bartlam]

Let's put it this way, the National FA will be interested if anyone has any ideas mate. 

From where I look at it, I just think we need to try and do what we can. It wasn't the same when we had a bad referee shortage a few seasons ago. I worked hard to get people on that course; just over half of them stayed in the game. Last season I don't actually think the ref shortage was as bad as it wa stage season before. So that was a positive.

I like to put my all into everything I do mate. One thing that I'd like to do is get more people playing the game (and/or returning to it). I'll try whatever it takes to do that. Unfortunately I've got very little time these days as I have so many commitments to fulfil I'm other areas of football, aswell as work and getting a balance with the family.

We'll be fine. I'm sure of it  You staying at Frogpool this year mate?

[yeww]

local 11 side football is on the decline, the big boys at the top are killing the game at grassroots level!! people need to realise this! low on refs, low on players! numbers do not lie! 

[Jacob-Englefield]

52 minutes ago, B_D said:

Let's put it this way, the National FA will be interested if anyone has any ideas mate. 

From where I look at it, I just think we need to try and do what we can. It wasn't the same when we had a bad referee shortage a few seasons ago. I worked hard to get people on that course; just over half of them stayed in the game. Last season I don't actually think the ref shortage was as bad as it wa stage season before. So that was a positive.

I like to put my all into everything I do mate. One thing that I'd like to do is get more people playing the game (and/or returning to it). I'll try whatever it takes to do that. Unfortunately I've got very little time these days as I have so many commitments to fulfil I'm other areas of football, aswell as work and getting a balance with the family.

We'll be fine. I'm sure of it  You staying at Frogpool this year mate?

I think that's part of the problem though. We must be running out of initiatives to keep people involved in the game. If we are honest, it's probably a sign of the current times. The fact of the matter is, some people out there find better things to do than play a game of football on a Saturday.

I agree with you on the shortage of referees. It certainly didn't seem as though there was as much of a problem in the season just gone compared to a couple of seasons ago. Full credit must go to those who worked hard to keep the current crop of referees we've got, plus recruit some new referees. It's a job not many people want to do, and understandably so. Let's hope the numbers either stay the same, or increase.

Whether people disagree or not with things you post on here or other forums, one thing they can't take away is your commitment towards football in Cornwall and nationally as well. It's evident you do your best in many different situations. I do think it might be a difficult one trying to get more people to return to the game. However, it might be slightly easier to get people, particularly youngsters, involved in the game.

I'm staying involved with Frogpool again this season. I'll be doing more behind the scenes this season though rather than playing on the pitch.

48 minutes ago, yeww said:

local 11 side football is on the decline, the big boys at the top are killing the game at grassroots level!! people need to realise this! low on refs, low on players! numbers do not lie! 

I don't like to admit it but it certainly does seem as though football is declining in some areas. I still enjoy being involved in football in Cornwall. However, there is definitely a wider problem nationally. It does seem as though there are some individuals at the top of the game who are killing our beautiful game, intentionally or not.

[Steve Carpenter]

16 hours ago, Bobjfh said:

I think that while the FA continue to mark its own success by the number of 'new' teams then they are part of the actual problem. You can get funding (for kit and set up costs) for a 'new' team but not for bringing  an existing u16 youth team (at your club) through into men's football - if they go to another club they can get funding??

Not so sure that this is still the case Bob.  Although the fund that the grants are paid from is called 'Grow The Game' this is an historic title from when it was indeed the intent to generate new clubs/teams and 'grow the game'.  As I said in an earlier post the emphasis at FA level has certainly moved from growing to sustaining though there will almost inevitably be churn with clubs folding and others popping up.  I'm pretty sure (though I may well be wrong) that a couple of clubs that I know of have had grants for new teams that have been predominantly been the previous years U16's.

17 hours ago, Bobjfh said:

Flexi football is, in my opinion, an extension of this - create new flexi teams, which will still take from the 'existing' pool of players - I can't see this attracting extra players - if they want to progress to Saturday football, they will join Saturday teams. 

Flexi Football is very definitely not targeted at existing players in existing teams and there will be restrictions.   It's played mid-week under lights in two periods (pre and post Xmas) with a maximum of 8 teams in each period.  New clubs/teams looking to get established, players not currently playing on Saturdays or at all and post U16's that aren't ready for open age football are the prime target areas.  The loss of players coming out of U16 football is huge and is one of the key areas of concern. 

16 hours ago, Jacob-Englefield said:

I am in favour of new clubs/teams entering the Trelawny League. However, like a few have mentioned already, you've got to be careful about who you let in. I think those who wish to enter the league have to prove that they are serious about joining the league and that they'll continue to compete in the league for so many years after joining. Something like a 5 year plan would definitely help them prove to the league that they'll be around for the long term rather than the short term.

I understand where you're coming from Jacob but to be blunt a plan wouldn't be worth the paper it was written on.  I could form a club tomorrow, spend an hour putting a plan together, present that at the AGM, get accepted and after a season decide to abandon everything.  The League has a development plan and the Charter Standard system, whilst not perfect, meets the needs of any other plan that a club may produce and the annual health checks that this system requires guides clubs along best practice.  It also opens up avenues of support if your club starts to struggle for whatever reason and a number of our clubs have taken advantage of that support over the years.

 

16 hours ago, WendronOfficial said:

St Kew in the East are a great example of a team entering a league; they've played Sunday League for several seasons, established themselves, and are now entering as a Saturday side in the Duchy. A good model to follow I think. 

I agree and it's what we did when we started Stithians all those years ago.  However, for many good reasons, it's not the model that many want to follow and then you come up against how do you enforce it as the pathway into Saturday football.  That would take a lot of working through and I suspect may come up against some regulatory obstacles. 

[Tempo]

I voted yes, but it really does depend. New clubs / teams should have to state where they expect the majority of their players coming from. For example TMS want to re-enter using mainly youth players from Truro from last year, and players who couldn't quite get into the first team on a regular basis last season after the reserve team folded. They have the makings of being a well ran second side, despite the problems of last year. Individual cases need to be analysed closely because if another side was to crop up in the Camborne area, you can beat teams like Storm will see themselves struggling again this year.

[Bobjfh]

Steve - as always a 'font of knowledge'.

The issue of funding by the CCFA does still worry me though as I know from first hand experience, this season, where a predominantly u16 team coming through to form a men's team  (including new men's players) were declined a grant as 'not a new team'. Hopefully thing are changing though. 

[Jacob-Englefield]

12 hours ago, Steve Carpenter said:

I understand where you're coming from Jacob but to be blunt a plan wouldn't be worth the paper it was written on.  I could form a club tomorrow, spend an hour putting a plan together, present that at the AGM, get accepted and after a season decide to abandon everything.  The League has a development plan and the Charter Standard system, whilst not perfect, meets the needs of any other plan that a club may produce and the annual health checks that this system requires guides clubs along best practice.  It also opens up avenues of support if your club starts to struggle for whatever reason and a number of our clubs have taken advantage of that support over the years.

I agree Steve. Perhaps a plan wouldn't be worth the paper it's written on. I haven't seen the development plan, but surely the Charter Standard wouldn't make a difference as to how long teams are around for? Clubs/teams could complete the check and then just abandon everything a year down the line. To be fair, we could go around in circles and cover old ground. The only difficult thing you've got on your hands is whether clubs/teams trying to enter the league are genuine or not. Because that's the worst thing we can do, turn teams away who are genuine and want to make a real go of things.

[GEACH1]

Trexit??

[Martin Eddy]

The clubs get checked and have to update regularly to stay in the league because we are updating our details at present. On another note will the combo league be adopting the charter standard if the two leagues join together. I know that trelawney clubs with combo sides are already covered but if say Perranwell do not get excepted into the league would they have to get qualified. Not saying they will not get voted in just using them as an example

[Dave Bartlam]

2 hours ago, Postman Pat said:

The clubs get checked and have to update regularly to stay in the league because we are updating our details at present. On another note will the combo league be adopting the charter standard if the two leagues join together. I know that trelawney clubs with combo sides are already covered but if say Perranwell do not get excepted into the league would they have to get qualified. Not saying they will not get voted in just using them as an example

As per the FA Charter Standard League Guidelines (available at thefa.com), any club/team joining a Charter Standard League should achieve Charter Standard status within one year of joining. As a previous club Secretary starting a club from scratch, I can vouch for how easy and simple it is to get sorted, especially with the guidance I received from Scooby at the time of putting the pack together.

A new club/team joining the league or a team/club who has lost it's Charter Standard status (it happens more frequently than we think) will obviously get the full support from the League and County FA Charter Standard Coordinators to help them achieve the accreditation. For all those that are Charter Standard and have used it, you will hopefully understand the importance of the scheme and understand why our Charter Standard Coordinator (and the league) do their utmost to ensure 100% participation/compliance.

On the Charter Standard note, please be aware that the deadline for the Annual Health Check for all CS clubs is Friday. Clubs requiring assistance are encouraged to contact Grace at the Cornwall FA (grace.dent@cornwallfa.com)

[Dave Deacon]

On 27/06/2017 at 15:13, B_D said:

For all those that are Charter Standard and have used it, you will hopefully understand the importance of the scheme and understand why our Charter Standard Coordinator (and the league) do their utmost to ensure 100% participation/compliance.

Is there anywhere one can refer to to see the benefits listed as a quick reference point?

[cornishteddyboy]

Been told that the lowest division will consist of

Lizard
Troon
Stithians 
Wendron 
Madron 
Hayle
Constantine 
Goonhaven 
Mousehole 
Perranwell
Praze and beeble 
Probus 
Penzance 

[Dave Bartlam]

3 hours ago, Dave Deacon said:

Is there anywhere one can refer to to see the benefits listed as a quick reference point?

http://www.thefa.com/CharterStandard

A simple google search can get you all sorts of information about it Dave. There are plenty of benefits to it.

I'll have a full run-down of the AGM new tomorrow. I've just spent the last few hours sorting out Full Time so we could get it live tonight.

[Sijames]

8 hours ago, cornishteddyboy said:

Been told that the lowest division will consist of

Lizard
Troon
Stithians 
Wendron 
Madron 
Hayle
Constantine 
Goonhaven 
Mousehole 
Perranwell
Praze and beeble 
Probus 
Penzance 

No TMS Res? cant believe mousehole got the nod and TMS Res didn't after all Mousehole 2nd's couldn't even raise a side last season for a number of games and now they want a 3rd team, ludicrous! 

 

[Footballfollower]

25 minutes ago, Sijames said:

No TMS Res? cant believe mousehole got the nod and TMS Res didn't after all Mousehole 2nd's couldn't even raise a side last season for a number of games and now they want a 3rd team, ludicrous! 

 

I am also surprised....I was at AGM and 9 spaces were potentially available to new teams and only 8 applied....yet TMS reserves did not get in!! how does that happen. I know they had their problems last season, but so did others......think TMS should think about an appeal as a very good case, (if they can be bothered)

also from the list above.....13 teams.....so every week someone does not play....why not make it even and add another team??

[Dave Deacon]

7 minutes ago, Footballfollower said:

also from the list above.....13 teams.....so every week someone does not play....why not make it even and add another team??

Assuming that the info now showing on the FA Full Time site is  appropriate - Division 3 also has an odd number.

I know initially the thought is that someone's going to have to sit out a Saturday, but in reality how often, when there has been an even number of teams in a division, has a full programme of fixtures happened?

[Footballfollower]

it's not so much has a full programme of fixtures been filled, because the answer would probably be no, due to weather, pitch problems, lack of players.....but they would have ALL had a fixture initially.....I really don't understand why any league has odd numbers.....isn't it basic maths?? even numbers = every is fixture.....or was there a hidden agenda to keep it uneven and keep certain teams out??? #conspiracytheory or #theydontknowwhattheyaredoing

[Dave Deacon]

Did no one at the meeting last night query the "odd number" position?

[Sijames]

15 teams in Div 3, 13 in Div 4....why not just go 14 in each?!

[#sausagefingers]

Div 3 has 15 teams which includes newlyn who finished 6th in div 4 last season.yet div four now has 13 teams.. every other league has 14 teams.was it necessary to promote newyln if didn't every league would have 14 ?

[Dave Bartlam]

18 minutes ago, Footballfollower said:

it's not so much has a full programme of fixtures been filled, because the answer would probably be no, due to weather, pitch problems, lack of players.....but they would have ALL had a fixture initially.....I really don't understand why any league has odd numbers.....isn't it basic maths?? even numbers = every is fixture.....or was there a hidden agenda to keep it uneven and keep certain teams out??? #conspiracytheory or #theydontknowwhattheyaredoing

Woahhhh, calm down with the ridiculous claims there!

Threemilestone Reserves were not successful in their application to join the league. This was a CLUB MAJORITY vote. The clubs spoke, they got what they wanted. That's how it works. Of course, Threemilestone can appeal on the grounds of "unconstitutional conduct" if they so wish. All of this is laid down in the League Rules, openly available on our Full Time website.

As Steve mentioned previously, the league format (numbers in the divisions) is laid down in the League's Constitution. Three divisions of 14 (which you have in Premier, Division one and Divisions two) and two divisions of 15. So, 15 teams in Division 3. Because of the numbers, we were unable to accommodate 15 in division 4 and so that division now remains at 13. These are the league rules - clubs were offered their chance to propose changes to the rules last season. If the league have no proposals for rule changes, that means everyone is happy. Surely?

@Sijames considering you were of the opinion that no teams should have been allowed to join... You now want 14 in each? If you'd had your way, division four would have been lost.

 

[Dave Deacon]

7 minutes ago, B_D said:

If the league have no proposals for rule changes, that means everyone is happy. Surely?

You and I know that it's not a case of being happy, more like a bigger case of apathy! 

[Dave Bartlam]

Just now, Dave Deacon said:

You and I know that it's not a case of being happy, more like a bigger case of apathy! 

I'm not one to speculate Dave... The thing is, it's no good critisicing the league structure etc or anything that is in the League Rules when the opportunity is there to change things. Some you win...

[Footballfollower]

9 minutes ago, B_D said:

Woahhhh, calm down with the ridiculous claims there!

Threemilestone Reserves were not successful in their application to join the league. This was a CLUB MAJORITY vote. The clubs spoke, they got what they wanted. That's how it works. Of course, Threemilestone can appeal on the grounds of "unconstitutional conduct" if they so wish. All of this is laid down in the League Rules, openly available on our Full Time website.

As Steve mentioned previously, the league format (numbers in the divisions) is laid down in the League's Constitution. Three divisions of 14 (which you have in Premier, Division one and Divisions two) and two divisions of 15. So, 15 teams in Division 3. Because of the numbers, we were unable to accommodate 15 in division 4 and so that division now remains at 13. These are the league rules - clubs were offered their chance to propose changes to the rules last season. If the league have no proposals for rule changes, that means everyone is happy. Surely?

@Sijames considering you were of the opinion that no teams should have been allowed to join... You now want 14 in each? If you'd had your way, division four would have been lost.

 

B_D...get a sense of humour, the hashtags were banter....are you a referee by any chance?? :-)

in regard to your comments, "could not accommodate 15 in Div 4, (yet some teams applied but were unsuccessful, understand the voting), but surely that throws the league constitution into disarray and opens up other challenges, as only 13 in Div 4, so the constitution is not abided by?

constitutions are all very well, if stuck to, not ad hoc to fit a situation.....lets hope no one in any teams are a solicitor, or a coach and horses could be driven through the constitution :-)

[Dave Bartlam]

Just now, Footballfollower said:

B_D...get a sense of humour, the hashtags were banter....are you a referee by any chance?? :-)

in regard to your comments, "could not accommodate 15 in Div 4, (yet some teams applied but were unsuccessful, understand the voting), but surely that throws the league constitution into disarray and opens up other challenges, as only 13 in Div 4, so the constitution is not abided by?

constitutions are all very well, if stuck to, not ad hoc to fit a situation.....lets hope no one in any teams are a solicitor, or a coach and horses could be driven through the constitution :-)

I've got banter in me... Somewhere lol

May I point you in the direction of the League Constitution and the Handbook please. This is all covered in there